the nazis, the occult, and the ahnenerbe., nazi secrets and the allies. Options

[tv with legs]

well, ive always been into that paranormal and conspiracy stuff, but this is the most interesting. ive always been puzzled by WWll.





"Nov. 21, 2000 (CBS) Imagine a lake more mysterious than Loch Ness - a lake that hides a secret no one was meant to discover. There is such a place high up in the Austrian Alps. It is a lake

Early one morning in 1945, Nazi S.S. officers sank a number of wooden boxes in Toplitz. Legend has it that the lake conceals everything from Nazi gold to the darkest secrets of Hitler's Reich. This summer, 60 Minutes II led an underwater expedition in search of those boxes. They found evidence of a Nazi plot you didn't read about in your history books. What's in Hitler's lake? CBS News Correspondent Scott Pelley reports on the secrets at the bottom of Lake Toplitz.

It is hard to imagine a better place to hide. In a dense mountain forest, Lake Toplitz lies secluded, folded deep into the Alps of western Austria. It isn't large - just a mile long. What is daunting is the depth.

Getting to the bottom of Toplitz is a journey. After 30 feet, the sun goes dark. Below 100 feet, the water is nearly freezing. At 348 feet, the bottom comes into view. There is no life (no plants and no fish) because there is no oxygen in the water. In 1945, Toplitz was practically as remote as the moon. And with secrets to keep, Toplitz was just what the Nazis were looking for.

Feb. 23, 1945: Hitler's Reich was tumbling down. The Allies were closing in and, in bombed-out Berlin, the Nazis were scrambling to truck their most valuable secrets out of town.

Adolf Burger was expecting to die at the Sachsenhausen concentration camp. He was the man who knew too much - a Jew who had been forced to work on a top-secret Nazi plot. "That means I am someone who is privy to state secrets, they always end up dead; they were always liquidated," said Burger.

He and several other prisoners were forced to participate in a covert Nazi project creating fake currency to crash Allied economies - including that of the United States.

When the project was abruptly ended, Burger was told to pack the counterfeit currency into boxes. He didn't know at the time, but the product of his work was taken to the Nazis' last holdout: the Austrian mountains called the Alpine Fortress. The Nazis planned to evacuate Hitler and a guerrilla army to the region around Lake Toplitz.

In the Alpine Fortress, time ran out on the Reich. By April 1945, Hitler was dead in Berlin, and the Allies were closing in all around. You could actually hear the artillery echoing in the mountains. Many of the last leaders of the Nazi regime fled there - some to make a last stand, others to try to save some remnant of the Reich in hope of starting over one day.

And Adolf Berger's work was essential to that plan.

The cargo was so well hidden that, chances are, no one would have ever seen the boxes again if it weren't for a 21-year-old Austrian farm girl. Ida Weisenbacher saw where the boxes went. She lives in the same house near Lake Toplitz where Nazi soldiers found her 55 years ago.

"It was five o'clock in the morning, we were still in bed when we heard the knock on the door," remembered Weisenbacher. "'Get up immediately hitch up the horse wagon, we need you.'"

They needed the wagon because the truck had reached the end of the road. Only horses could make it to Toplitz. "A commander was there. He told us to bring these boxes as fast as possible to Lake Toplitz," added Weisenbacher.

She said each box was labeled with bold-painted letters and a corresponding number.

She carried three wagonloads to the lake. "When I brought the last load, I saw how they went on to the lake and dropped the boxes into the water.... The S.S. kept shoving me away but I saw the boxes were sunk into the lake," said Weisenbacher.

The Nazis knew that searching a place so cold, so dark, and so deep wouldn't be possible with the technology of the time. But they couldn't have foreseen a phantom in the future.

The Phantom is a deep-diving robot operated by Oceaneering Technologies in Maryland connected by a tether to a pilot on the surface. Jeff Kowalishen is one of the pilots of the underwater craft: "It's hard to hide something from this type of equipment."

Oceaneering uses The Phantom around the world on some of the toughest jobs imaginable. It was Oceaneering that recovered the wreckage of the Space Shuttle Challenger, lifted TWA Flight 800 off the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean and located the aircraft of John F. Kennedy Jr.

60 Minutes II hired Oceaneering to search every inch of Lake Toplitz and recover the boxes if they could be found. "No one has tried at Toplitz to do this, but we have done this type of work all over the world," said Kowalishen.

But in that part of the world, the project wasn't entirely welcome. The region once known as the Alpine Fortress still celebrates its traditions, but many Austrians don't like dredging up reminders of a Nazi past.

It was in the winter of 1999 that negotiations were started with the Austrian government and the country's forestry service. After being assured the project wouldn't hurt the environment, the Austrians agreed to lease the lake for 30 days - an incredibly tight schedule for what the Oceaneering team was about to attempt.

There had been other dives in Lake Toplitz over the years, and artifacts related to the project had been raised before. But this expedition was to be the first comprehensive search of Toplitz. The dive would cost over $600,000, with major funding provided by the World Jewish Congress.
Toplitz doesn't seem large until you search it inch by inch. The video image relayed from the remote submarine is only three feet wide. The first thing Oceaneering found was a layer of silt on the bottom that often blew like a blizzard, blinding the camera.

Team member Ian Griffith of San Francisco is an expert on the remote-controlled subs. "If we are too high, we are not going to see anything. If we are too low, we are going to destroy the visibility and not see anything," he said.

For 12 hours a day, the crew strained for some familiar shape. "We have four pilots. You can only do it for so long, and then it really becomes monotonous," said Griffith.

But there was no hint of anything like Adolf Burger's boxes. It was possible the boxes were buried or covered in silt. It was also possible, after 55 years, they had just crumbled away.

The long days turned into weeks - nearly three weeks of searching. The submarine would cover more than 35 miles altogether. The 30-day deadline imposed by the Austrians was getting closer. And Oceaneering couldn't get a break from the lake.

To the tethered mini-sub, the lake floor was a minefield. Oceaneering expected trees but not underwater forests. Trees had fallen from the mountain and were stacked 60 feet high in some places. The Phantom would spend days lost in the woods.

And when it wasn't the trees, it was the weather.

The picture-postcard lake often developed a foul mood. There were hailstorms and lightning.

The crew figured it was out of luck when a bolt of lightning struck the navigation system, and the search pattern wasn't reliable anymore. But Kowalishen wanted to press on, guiding The Phantom by dead reckoning and as it turns out, dumb luck.

Then a discovery was made -- not the intact boxes the crew hoped to find, but the remains of something decades old, pieces of wood that might have come from the Nazi crates."


hmmmm, <.<


"Ukrainian workers recently found strange graves at a construction site in the Ukraine. They thought it was an ancient Scythian graveyard until someone spotted the medallion of a German soldier in one of the coffins. When archeologists arrived, they were shocked to find that some of the human skeletons had their spines sawn lengthwise. Some did not have heads, while others had skull trepanation (holes drilled in them), as if they were trying to create a "third eye."
Experts decided the bodies were victims of the Ahnenerbe, the most secret organization of the Nazi Third Reich. The victims were not Jews—they were what Germans called “Aryans,” the “pure race.” Ahnenerbe’s doctors were doing medical experiments on them, trying to create a new breed of human being.

Ahnenerbe, which means “Ancestors’ Inheritance,” was founded in 1933 by philosopher Friedrich Gilscher, along with a Dr. Hirt. After the Nazis gained power, Ahnenerbe was entrusted with searching for the traditions of the Indo- German Nordic race. In 1937, the organization became part of the SS. Their studies were designed to prove the superiority of the Aryan race in order to vindicate Nazi racial policies, and some of Germany’s best scientists did this research. They went on expeditions to the Middle East, Ukraine, and Tibet. When Soviet troops entered Berlin in 1945, they were surprised to find thousands of Tibetan corpses in SS uniforms.

In the summer of 1944, Hirt was ordered to destroy his laboratories. He didn’t manage to do it before the allies arrived, so troops found many beheaded corpses. Hirt disappeared afterwards and was later seen, along with other escaped Nazis, in Chile and in Paraguay.

Ahnenerbe’s members were all tall, muscular, blond men, like most Nazis (except, interestingly enough, for Hitler himself). They were supposed to get married in their twenties to racially pure women (again, Hitler remained single). Karl Maria Willigut, a black magician with a large influence on Nazi high-ranking officials, was the most famous person in the organization.

They tried to invent a psychotropic weapon for mind control, and did experiments on humans. By the end of the war, Nazis were testing “flying disks,” and Ahnenerbe may have had a large air base in Antarctica. There are rumors that this base still exists and that there is an underground city there called New Berlin with a population of 2 million people who work on genetic engineering and space exploration. Indirect proof of this is the fact that UFOs are often be seen around the South Pole. In 1976, the Japanese saw 19 round objects there in a single sighting."



"After forty years, the Chilean authorities have broken up the Colonia Dignidad commune, which was founded by escaped Nazis and Nazi sympathizers. It aided the cruel military dictatorship of that has been accused of aiding the former military dictatorship of General Augusto Pinochet.
BBC News reports that former Nazi Paul Schaefer, aged 83, is being accused of aiding secret police under Chile's 1973-1990 military rule and also of sexually abusing 26 children. He was arrested in March after hiding out for eighteen years. Along with other Colonia Dignidad leaders, he was suspected of keeping the 300 remaining residents in the camp against their will. An American reporter who investigated the colony was never seen again.

One American who visited this evil encampment and DID make it out again is Peter Levenda, who has done a special report on the conditions he saw there for Dreamland radio. We asked Peter for his reaction to the closing of Colonia Dignidad.

Levenda says, "I applaud the Chilean government for its decision to close, once and for all, that obscenity known as Colonia Dignidad, although it seems to me that a state- appointed exorcist might do better for the place than a state- appointed lawyer at this point!

"The Colony has existed for more than 40 years, and during that time it has been home to so much horror, pain and bloodshed that the land itself must cry out. The people who have lived there all of their lives should be the first consideration for any government-sponsored mental health program. Few of the Colony's inhabitants when I was there spoke Spanish; German and English were the preferred tongues. They lived in total isolation from the rest of the world, and knew only Schaefer as their spiritual and political leader. We have an unprecedented opportunity to study people who have lived under this kind of brutal, totalitarian regime -- a Jonestown in the Andes -- and more importantly to help them rejoin the rest of society. It will not be easy, either for them or for the Chilean government or its people, but it must be done.

"For me, it is like the end of an era. Since I visited—gate- crashed—there in 1979 till the present day, I have been writing about it, speaking about it, and agitating for something to be done about the Colony. It is finally being put to rest, the doors opened, the people allowed—encouraged— to leave. I hope the Chilean government will be swift in opening its files on this case, revealing to everyone what really went on at the Colony, and equally swift in prosecuting Paul Schaefer, the founder and commandant of one of the most notorious interrogation and torture centers in the western hemisphere. I fear that such revelations might demonstrate a close working relationship between the Pinochet regime and our own government, however, and that therefore we may have to wait a long time before the whole story is known. "



"A reader writes: "I am a lawyer from Chile currently living in Florida. Talking of disappeared Nazis, you spoke (with Nick Cook on Sept. 28 Dreamland) of a place in Chile that was only recently closed down. Unfortunately, I must inform you that such place, formerly known as 'Colonia Dignidad,' still exists." A former SS officer used local slave labor to build an empire, where he founded a hospital that sterilizes poor against their will and steals their newborn children. He has sexually abused hundreds of minors. U.S. citizen Boris Weisfeiler was captured by Augusto Pinochet and taken to Colonia Dignidad, where he has never been seen again"



?
do you all have any iformation about these things? or heard stories?
i heard that the US had its own paranormal war with hitler. hmmmm.

[Mata]

Then a discovery was made -- not the intact boxes the crew hoped to find, but the remains of something decades old, pieces of wood that might have come from the Nazi crates."

So... Did they? It's a good story except for the slight problem that it's missing an end.

They were supposed to get married in their twenties to racially pure women (again, Hitler remained single).

Except for his sixteen year relationship with Eva Braun, who he eventually married. Such an oversight in known facts doesn't encourage trust in their less-corroborated propositions!

They tried to invent a psychotropic weapon for mind control

Which means 'they didn't invent a psychotropic weapon for mind control'.

By the end of the war, Nazis were testing “flying disks,”

So were the Americans, and the British too I believe.

Ahnenerbe may have had a large air base in Antarctica.

May?

There are rumors that this base still exists and that there is an underground city there called New Berlin with a population of 2 million people who work on genetic engineering and space exploration.

Ah well, if there are rumours then that proves it! Is it worth mentioning that DNA wasn't discovered until after the end of WWII, and if this city is surviving without external supplies then it must have limitless energy, such as nuclear reactors - which the Nazis also didn't have the technology for.

Indirect proof of this is the fact that UFOs are often be seen around the South Pole. In 1976, the Japanese saw 19 round objects there in a single sighting.

Now we're talking, we have 'indirect proof' of a 'fact'! Well, I'm convinced...

I've seen round objects near my house this winter, do you think it's a Nazi invasion? They were, admittedly, snowballs, but you can never be too careful.

I must inform you that such place, formerly known as 'Colonia Dignidad,' still exists.

This one is verifiable:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4340591.stm

It seems the camp has two sides, one that is an old-fashioned, but basically reasonable, place to live, and another that provided torture facilities for the Chilean authorities. The latter probably meant the apparently systemic abuse of young boys by the Paul Schaefer was ignored. Nasty stuff.

[tv with legs]

i didnt write this stuff, someone esle did. but it just, intriged me.

[Mata]

I realise that, I was just pointing out that they're a bit slim on details, aren't they?

[Astarael]

Interesting conspiracy theories. They would doubtless make a good Da Vince Code type of book if you assumed that it was all true, but I don't really believe them. Little bits of wood underwater that may have come from Nazi crates don't really prove anything, you can really tilt a lot of these facts in different directions, and I have to agree that the stuff is very thin on facts and long on wild speculation. Thanks for sharing, though. It was an interesting read, especially the stuff about the Nazi compound in Chile.

[tv with legs]

I realise that, I was just pointing out that they're a bit slim on details, aren't they?

yeah, true. but rumors come from somewhere.
im just trying to figure out, if the nazis really DID anything secret. like the V2 rocket was. i just boggles my head!

[Mata]

Usually I suspect rumours come from people like me making up things that sound fun. I love reading these kinds of things though

[Calantyr]

I hear the Nazi's also managed to aquire the Ark of the Covenant and the Holy Grail too. If briefly.

[PsychWardMike]

I believe this is all accurately chronicled in the Castle Wolfensein series. I'd check them for your sources.

[tv with legs]

I love reading these kinds of things though

haha, i do too! ^.^

ive played castle wofenstien, it doesnt mention anything about this stuff, except for expiramenting on people. i think.