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CommieBastard
post May 31 2005, 09:31 AM
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For those of you who don't read Pointless Waste of Time (warning: strong language and adult content), they recently posted an article called A Gamer's Manifesto: 20 things gamers want from the seventh generation of game consoles.

A lot of what they said hit home with me; some excerpts I particularly agreed with:

QUOTE
2. Give us a genre of game we've never seen before. Something that's not an FPS or an RPG or Madden NFL or...

Why isn't a there a spy game where we actually get to be a real spy rather than a hallway-roving kill machine? You know, where we actually have to talk to contacts and extract information and tap phones and piece together clues, a game full of exotic locales and deception and backstabbing and subplots? A game where a gun is used as often as a real spy would use it (that is, almost never)?

Where's the game where we're a castaway on a deserted island and the object of the game is to find food and clean water and build a shelter, a game where we can play for one month or six months, because whether or not we get rescued is randomized? Where every time we restart we get a different island with different wildlife and vegetation and water sources?

Where's the game where we play a salty Southern lawyer who has to piece together evidence to exonerate a black man falsely accused of murder, breaking down witnesses and spotting inconsistencies in testimony?


QUOTE
Developers will be shocked one day when they notice that the world is full of women. It's true! More than half of your potential customer base are penisless. They have money. They like doing fun things. And yet, how do you think they feel when they play a game where the heroine looks like this:



Yeah, that's what she wears into battle. Thong-length kimono, no bra for those flopping DDD breasts.

And this is years after analysts told developers that women would happily play games if they didn't feel so objectified by them, and several decades past the point where they should have even needed to be told that. Have you guys ever met a woman? Then why don't you try making just a few games that don't play off of a 14 year-old male's idea of womanhood on the apparent hope that he'll play the game one-handed?


Any thoughts on this?


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{Gothic Angel}
post Jun 5 2005, 07:36 PM
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Without haivng fully gone through the thread, I dont know how much of this has already been said, but...

QUOTE
Why isn't a there a spy game where we actually get to be a real spy rather than a hallway-roving kill machine? You know, where we actually have to talk to contacts and extract information and tap phones and piece together clues, a game full of exotic locales and deception and backstabbing and subplots? A game where a gun is used as often as a real spy would use it (that is, almost never)?


There are games like this. They just aren't mainstream. Theif, for example.

QUOTE
Where's the game where we're a castaway on a deserted island and the object of the game is to find food and clean water and build a shelter, a game where we can play for one month or six months, because whether or not we get rescued is randomized? Where every time we restart we get a different island with different wildlife and vegetation and water sources?


Again, if you want a game in a similar style to this, try age of empires or civilisation. You don't have to play those as hack-and-slash games, you can quite happily win through diplomatic alliances and civilisation building. Civilisation, Settlers... Any of these games can be played that way. Ok, so you're not a solo player, but its similar.

QUOTE
Developers will be shocked one day when they notice that the world is full of women. It's true! More than half of your potential customer base are penisless. They have money. They like doing fun things.

And this is years after analysts told developers that women would happily play games if they didn't feel so objectified by them, and several decades past the point where they should have even needed to be told that. Have you guys ever met a woman? Then why don't you try making just a few games that don't play off of a 14 year-old male's idea of womanhood on the apparent hope that he'll play the game one-handed?


Ok, I will admit that she does make me think "Jesus, get a bra, girl.", but to be honest, Im playing this game for leisure. I am not an attractive, slinky person in real life. I don't want to spend my leisure time pretending to be someone who is just as dull and unattractive as me. I want to have an adventure. I want to know Kung-fu. And I want to do it all looking sexy, without getting a hair out of place.

I will admit, I do sometimes look for a new game and come up empty handed, but then again, you can just look at the games you already played and think "What if I played that in a different way?".

My point being, I guess that you don't have to hack and slash your way through everything. And you can look at the topless women and say : Yes, she's stupidly unrealistic, but at the end of the day, I dont need to worry about that, becuse, at the end of the day, she's an animated tool for me to complete this storyline in. I can enjoy the game without worrying about her. It's like reading victorian literature and forgetting that back then all the heroes were male.

And, guys... Tell me there hasn't been an animated character, game or otherwise that you wouldn't do anyday of the week.


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arachnidoc17
post Jun 7 2005, 10:00 PM
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QUOTE ({Gothic Angel} @ Jun 5 2005, 03:36 PM)
There are games like this. They just aren't mainstream. Theif, for example.
*


Yuh-huh...

"Thief" is pretty much Splinter Cell with blackjacks and magic arrows. Good game though.


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Posts in this topic
- CommieBastard   What's Wrong With Gaming?   May 31 2005, 09:31 AM
- - moop   I pretty much agree with most of that. The games i...   May 31 2005, 11:12 AM
|- - CommieBastard   QUOTE (moop @ May 31 2005, 12:12 PM)Personall...   May 31 2005, 12:02 PM
- - Mata   A programmer friend of mine was at E3 and found th...   May 31 2005, 01:00 PM
- - PsychWardMike   Read the article, actually I was kicking around ma...   May 31 2005, 06:59 PM
|- - Mata   QUOTE (PsychWardMike @ May 31 2005, 06:59 PM)...   Jun 1 2005, 01:32 AM
- - arachnidoc17   I mean, seriously, ever since "the Guy Game...   May 31 2005, 11:08 PM
- - Calantyr   There are truly few people willing to make the lea...   Jun 2 2005, 02:09 AM
- - arachnidoc17   REZ is a really innovative game, it's really o...   Jun 2 2005, 09:35 PM
|- - Jonman   QUOTE (arachnidoc17 @ Jun 2 2005, 10:35 PM)RE...   Jun 3 2005, 08:27 AM
|- - CommieBastard   QUOTE (Jonman @ Jun 3 2005, 09:27 AM)Don...   Jun 3 2005, 09:41 AM
- - Mata   The visual style and the connection between the im...   Jun 3 2005, 09:45 AM
- - PsychWardMike   Then by your definition, Mata, wouldn't Viewti...   Jun 3 2005, 01:15 PM
- - Jonman   QUOTE (mata)The visual style and the connection be...   Jun 3 2005, 01:40 PM
- - Mata   Eyetoy I think is a good example here: great fun f...   Jun 3 2005, 04:32 PM
- - Museum Girl   QUOTE (CommieBastard @ May 31 2005, 10:31 AM)...   Jun 3 2005, 11:55 PM
|- - MistressAlti   QUOTE (Museum Girl @ Jun 3 2005, 05:55 PM)Spe...   Jun 6 2005, 03:59 PM
|- - Museum Girl   QUOTE (MistressAlti @ Jun 6 2005, 04:59 PM)QU...   Jun 6 2005, 05:47 PM
|- - CommieBastard   QUOTE (Museum Girl @ Jun 6 2005, 06:47 PM)Adm...   Jun 6 2005, 06:18 PM
|- - Jonman   QUOTE (CommieBastard @ Jun 6 2005, 07:18 PM)Q...   Jun 6 2005, 07:09 PM
|- - CommieBastard   QUOTE (Jonman @ Jun 6 2005, 08:09 PM)Undergro...   Jun 6 2005, 07:41 PM
- - Calantyr   If you want a good Spy game, dig up Spycraft: The ...   Jun 4 2005, 01:09 AM
- - gothictheysay   QUOTE Speaking as one of the penisless ones, and f...   Jun 4 2005, 01:14 AM
- - Museum Girl   QUOTE (gothictheysay @ Jun 4 2005, 02:14 AM)Q...   Jun 4 2005, 10:15 PM
|- - CommieBastard   QUOTE (Museum Girl @ Jun 4 2005, 11:15 PM)Thi...   Jun 4 2005, 10:56 PM
|- - Museum Girl   QUOTE (CommieBastard @ Jun 4 2005, 11:56 PM)Q...   Jun 4 2005, 11:28 PM
- - Aislinn Faye   Someone who complains about what the women look li...   Jun 5 2005, 01:40 AM
- - PsychWardMike   Let's face it, children... men and women both...   Jun 5 2005, 03:58 AM
|- - Jonman   QUOTE (PsychWardMike @ Jun 5 2005, 04:58 AM)L...   Jun 5 2005, 10:40 AM
- - Feyliya   I'm much more likely to play a sexy, fully-clo...   Jun 5 2005, 04:12 AM
- - Tarantio   I just thought it wasa good game because, although...   Jun 5 2005, 12:57 PM
- - Mata   It was a really good attempt to make a game that d...   Jun 5 2005, 05:29 PM
- - {Gothic Angel}   Without haivng fully gone through the thread, I do...   Jun 5 2005, 07:36 PM
|- - CommieBastard   QUOTE ({Gothic Angel} @ Jun 5 2005, 08:36 PM)...   Jun 5 2005, 08:45 PM
|- - arachnidoc17   QUOTE ({Gothic Angel} @ Jun 5 2005, 03:36 PM)...   Jun 7 2005, 10:00 PM
- - PsychWardMike   Comfortably cool, I'd say. Underground away f...   Jun 6 2005, 08:33 PM
|- - Jonman   QUOTE (PsychWardMike @ Jun 6 2005, 09:33 PM)C...   Jun 6 2005, 09:12 PM
- - Feyliya   QUOTE (Museum Girl @ Jun 6 2005, 09:47 AM)And...   Jun 6 2005, 08:47 PM
|- - Sir_Psycho_Sexy   QUOTE (Feyliya @ Jun 6 2005, 08:47 PM)QUOTE (...   Jun 7 2005, 02:55 PM
- - Tarantio   QUOTE ({Gothic Angel} @ Jun 5 2005, 07:36 PM)...   Jun 6 2005, 11:31 PM
|- - Jonman   QUOTE (Tarantio @ Jun 7 2005, 12:31 AM)Just t...   Jun 7 2005, 08:05 AM
- - Mata   She runs lots without getting tired and she can ju...   Jun 7 2005, 12:18 AM
|- - CommieBastard   QUOTE (Mata @ Jun 7 2005, 01:18 AM)As to whet...   Jun 7 2005, 07:02 AM
|- - arachnidoc17   QUOTE (Mata @ Jun 6 2005, 08:18 PM)Like the m...   Jun 7 2005, 09:55 PM
- - CommieBastard   From my experience with burning torches, they real...   Jun 7 2005, 08:30 AM
|- - Jonman   QUOTE (CommieBastard @ Jun 7 2005, 09:30 AM)F...   Jun 7 2005, 09:11 AM
|- - CommieBastard   QUOTE (Jonman @ Jun 7 2005, 10:11 AM)QUOTE (C...   Jun 7 2005, 09:32 AM
- - PsychWardMike   And clearly no experience with spelling the word ...   Jun 7 2005, 01:15 PM
- - PsychWardMike   Incorrect. Splinter Cell is Theif without blackja...   Jun 7 2005, 10:06 PM
- - arachnidoc17   And don't forget Hammerites!   Jun 7 2005, 10:08 PM
- - Tarantio   and, for jon's benefit, burning torches but...   Jun 7 2005, 10:46 PM
- - Museum Girl   QUOTE (CommieBastard @ Jun 6 2005, 07:18 PM)Q...   Jun 9 2005, 08:06 PM
- - Mata   Then again, if: I were a woman living in a land w...   Jun 9 2005, 11:43 PM
|- - Jonman   QUOTE (Mata @ Jun 10 2005, 12:43 AM)then I to...   Jun 10 2005, 07:11 AM
- - Mata   Yep, I even have a trained lizard/ape thing to kic...   Jun 10 2005, 11:05 AM
|- - Jonman   QUOTE (Mata @ Jun 10 2005, 12:05 PM)Yep, I ev...   Jun 10 2005, 11:11 AM
- - {Gothic Angel}   QUOTE (Tarantio @ Jun 7 2005, 10:46 PM)and, f...   Jun 14 2005, 07:38 AM
- - Mata   We are talking here about people who don't not...   Jun 14 2005, 01:05 PM


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