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Witless
post Jan 4 2006, 12:08 AM
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So I was watching a documentry made by a guy, it was about his issues with the size of his penis.
He talked about when it first started, it was because of an incident of with a girl when he was a teenager being pretty darn harsh to him about this size of his penis. He talked about how it's pretty much shaped his entire confidence about his sex and romantic life since, even though he's now in a stable 8th year of a relationship.

It got me thinking about how badly people forget how much more things effect us the younger we are, yet.. oddly enough we listen less and less to people the younger they are. The people best able to cope with the world are the people most in a position to voice their distress' and ignore and deal with trauma. Sorry to say it but even on the boards do I here people talk about "whiny teens" and annoying "angst ridden kids". I'm guilty of it too from time to time.

But well watching that documentry inspired me to drudging up a few memories of mine, and it's true, so many "minor" things from the past can shape so much about a person when their all young, even into their teens.

Not sure how to conclude this post.. so i'll just say, be a little less annoyed at the next person you think is upset over nothing!

Peace and happy new year!


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Kitty
post Jan 4 2006, 12:25 AM
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I dont think we get annoyed at teens for going through crap and thinking something about it, I think its mostly that we really do blow it out of porportion and try to milk people for all they're worth, sometimes. Us teens are indeed going through a difficult time in life. Hell, alot of teens have a better perspective on the world than alot of adults do.

I think the problem is alot of the time instead of talking about something, we instead whine about it and pull a "pitty me" act. I know I do it alot, and honestly dont usually mean it to get people to pitty me, really, but I'm not always exactly sure how to come out and talk to people about things and ask them questions, so instead I say "Well this this and this happened and now I feel like crap" and people will be like "Aww I"m sorry that happened" instead of something like "Well this happened, but I really think that I'm better because of it, do you agree?" And getting a good answer and be able to discuss it.


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little_bear
post Jan 4 2006, 01:28 AM
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As a teenager who is coming to the end of his years struggling through adolescence, I have to admit, I have found myself becoming annoyed at 'teens'.

Perhaps it is more I have begun to notice just how annoying the stereotypical male teenager is. As a teen myself, I was called a 'Kevin' (based on the character parodying teenagers by the comedian Harry Enfield) and was adamant I was nothing like that. To be honest, I've noticed Kevin like qualities in nigh-on every teenager I have met recently. Maybe it is a growing up thing; perhaps it is only natural to become annoyed by teenagers eventually.


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Pixelgoth
post Jan 4 2006, 01:18 PM
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I have to say that how you cope with situations really doesn't have that much to do with physical age. It has to do with maturity. I know a lot of "teens" who can cope with things much better than "adults". My brother is 28 and he still strops like a stereotypical "teen". I don't think he's ever grown out of it. I'm sure he has a reason why but quite frankly I don't want to hear his "pity me" stories anymore than the next person and he's related to me!

Maturity doesn't necessarily mean less moaning but it does mean taking more responsibility and having the tools to get yourself back together again smile.gif


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post Jan 4 2006, 01:37 PM
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QUOTE (little_bear @ Jan 4 2006, 01:28 AM)
Maybe it is a growing up thing; perhaps it is only natural to become annoyed by teenagers eventually.
*


Ah the teenage years... As some one who is also just reaching the end of them. I'd like to put this idea forward.
Itís not new, fresh or original but there you go.

Teenagers whine because they see inequality in the world but can't do anything about it as there to young to have the levels of money, power and influence necessary to begin any kind of major change on there own.

Older people dislike teenagers for one of two reasons,
1) They remind them of themselves when they were younger and how stupid and infantile they were (Sorry all you teens but itís the truth! We all act like idiots- itís why we have teenage years!!!)
2) Teens complain about the changes itís taken the older person there entire life to start happening in an effort to make other peoples lifeís better.

Ultimately I donít think that teens will ever stop wining, simply because everyone has a different outlook on life and a different idea of what needs to change.


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Witless
post Jan 4 2006, 03:08 PM
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regardless of maturity level.. it doesn't change the idea that stuff affects you a lot more the younger you are.

Some people's entire romantic lives are effected by a minor 1 minute conversation they had with someone when they were 13.
Some people's friendships are forever disabled because of single incidences that occured when they were younger. Seems somewhat then strange to then turn a blind eye to someone being distressed by something (even if it may seem trivial through our own eyes.)


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post Jan 4 2006, 03:54 PM
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QUOTE (Witless @ Jan 4 2006, 03:08 PM)
regardless of maturity level.. it doesn't change the idea that stuff affects you a lot more the younger you are.
*


I'd say that your maturity level was pretty important. The reason that small things dont affect older people as profoundly is because they have developed ways to get around them. A 'mature' person has more coping mechanisims and so is less affected. Thats why you can have mature 12 year olds and immature 60 year olds.
Besides everyone gets screwed up by there childhood but its necessary to prepare them for getting just screwed in adult life unsure.gif


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Witless
post Jan 4 2006, 04:06 PM
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my point isn't the reasons why these things happen.. my points is why are we so hard on people when it does?


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FeralPolyglot
post Jan 4 2006, 05:12 PM
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Part of the reason such minor things impact us so vastly when we're younger is that we're still growing and developing. We aren't even secure in ourselves yet and on top of that, we're supposed to anchor onto some point from which to address stressors of everyday life. Once you have matured a bit and your self-identity has more-or-less been formed, it's a lot easier to stand on this foundation and deal with the world.

The affect of trauma on a developing being is somewhat inversely proportional with their developmental stage. I know it's somewhat apples-and-oranges, but think of how much a small bump on the head can damage an infant and how little it affects us as more developed adults. Or how much temperature affects eggs as opposed to the full grown chicken. Or how much a little snap will hurt a sapling... Or even think about a club or a team... if you suffer losses and low morale from the get-go, it's a lot more impairing than if a team 20 years in the making endured the same blow. Once again, I know it's apples and oranges but just something to think about...

To address the question of why we're so hard on teens when they act the way they do, I think that it's for a few reasons... Once you grow past a point in your life and look back, you see that a lot of the things you felt were monumental were actually just molehills... Maybe people who have passed that point, at some level, hope that they can spare the teen the pain or unrest that they themselves felt at that time. Sort of thinking "If I'd only known at that time what I know now..." and trying to give the teen a heads up. Then again, also remember how headstrong some teens can be and how unwilling to accept advice some are... A lot of these good intentions end up being redirected to pave the road to Hell and just widen the gap. tongue.gif



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You deny me fres...
post Jan 4 2006, 05:25 PM
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QUOTE (Witless @ Jan 4 2006, 04:06 PM)
my point isn't the reasons why these things happen.. my points is why are we so hard on people when it does?
*


Sorry, I've not been clear here at all...
We're not hard on people when stuff happens, its simply that the person feels more put upon because they are unable to manage the problem. The people around them will usually be acting normaly. People may be indifferent to a person however- personaly I find this more frustrating then being picked upon.


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Jonman
post Jan 4 2006, 07:08 PM
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I read an interesting article a while back about how teenagers go through so many physical changes, brought about by crazy amounts of hormones flying around inside them. These hormones actually have a psyiological effect on the brain, causing them to have great difficulty in empathising with anyone else, which leads to the stereotypical self-obsessed teenage behaviour, "You don't understand me!", "I hate you" etc etc.

The article likened adolesence to a several year burst of mild Aspergers.


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bryden42
post Jan 4 2006, 07:09 PM
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QUOTE
Some people's entire romantic lives are effected by a minor 1 minute conversation they had with someone when they were 13.


I wouldn't suggest that this is a thing that only occurs in younger years. Life is an ongoing learning cycle, and people change throughout their lives. I got hurt quite badly at the age of 22 by a woman who was, in retrospect, absolutely no good for me and for good and bad she has changed the way I approach relationships. in the same vein i drilled into the floor to lay some carpet strip 2 days ago and flooded my house by drilling through a water main, believe me when i say that this has changed my drill happy D.I.Y. tendencies smile.gif .
I think that teenagers get a bad reputation for "whining" because they don't nescesarily have the support network built that some of us fogies do, when I have a bad day i talk to my wife (and vice versa) if it's something about my wife that is bugging me I talk to my friends, in short I have developed strategies for dealing with things that don't involve talking to anyone and everyone, i therefore don't seem to whine. Teenagers might not have this kind of experience or network. then again it may just be that teenagers haven't become so indentured that they have lost the ability to "rage against the dying of the night".


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EvilSpork
post Jan 6 2006, 04:01 AM
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Is it alright if you'd, you know, share the name of this documentary... I'm strangely interested.

More on topic... Most peoples insecurities stem from a younger age where people picked on them, made one rude comment etc... And it just sticks with us so strongly sometimes we start to believe it.

Really the idea behind the documentary sounds like something I'd want to watch. Not the penis size thing, but the nature/concept of what it is getting at.
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Calantyr
post Jan 6 2006, 05:52 PM
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When people are born they are a blank slate. Personality is yet to come. The initial development sets how they will react in future. When a person is old enough to start functioning as an intelligent individual (start of teens) certain events happen that send a base for further experience. Few have happenned so far, so I guess these become a kind of 'default' setting.

Is it really odd that throughout life these will time and time again be referred back to? Initial experiences are always the most powerful. Don't you remember your first kiss? The first time you had sex? Live on your own? Flew?

They stick in our minds because up until then we had not had a chance to deal with them. *How* we deal with them for that first time in some way helps define how we are for the rest of our lives.

If the experience was negative... well there we see the birth of insecurities. They can be overcome through later similar experiences that had a more happy ending, but they still lay as a 'default' setting unless they can be completely overwriten.

The human mind really is like a piece of software sometimes.

I guess all you can do is try to understand and help a person overcome this first experience.

Hmm... reading this thread has been quite therapeutic for me.


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EvilSpork
post Jan 6 2006, 06:58 PM
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Well, if you're going to take the stance of Durkheim, yes we are born with a blank slate...

Actually I'll edit this later, I have to go to the store to get some stuff to make dinner with. I guess I'm cooking tonight.
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tony64
post Jan 6 2006, 07:29 PM
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QUOTE (Witless @ Jan 4 2006, 12:08 AM)
So I was watching a documentry made by a guy, it was about his issues with the size of his penis.
He talked about when it first started, it was because of an incident of with a girl when he was a teenager being pretty darn harsh to him about this size of his penis. He talked about how it's pretty much shaped his entire confidence about his sex and romantic life since, even though he's now in a stable 8th year of a relationship.

It got me thinking about how badly people forget how much more things effect us the younger we are, yet.. oddly enough we listen less and less to people the younger they are. The people best able to cope with the world are the people most in a position to voice their distress' and ignore and deal with trauma. Sorry to say it but even on the boards do I here people talk about "whiny teens" and annoying "angst ridden kids". I'm guilty of it too from time to time.

But well watching that documentry inspired me to drudging up a few memories of mine, and it's true, so many "minor" things from the past can shape so much about a person when their all young, even into their teens.

Not sure how to conclude this post.. so i'll just say, be a little less annoyed at the next person you think is upset over nothing!

Peace and happy new year!
*
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Phyllis
post Jan 6 2006, 07:40 PM
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QUOTE (Calantyr @ Jan 6 2006, 09:52 AM)
When people are born they are a blank slate. Personality is yet to come.
*

Not entirely true. Most psychologists nowadays don't think that it's either completely nature or nurture that determines our personality...but a combination of both. It is generally believed that how you are raised is the more important of the two factors, though genetics is thought to play at least some role. Anyhow...

Ah, to be a teenager again. Not something I would ever, EVER want to do. Being in my 20's is so much better than...that. I was so constantly moody! If I had known about emo at the time, I probably would've been the emoest teenager to ever emo. Ugh. Well, I don't think I'd have liked the music...but the attitude was there.

I don't think that it's really about having a support network. I think it's just a weird, hormonal time in one's life, and it's frustrating because you feel all these rather adult things but are still treated essentially like a child. As far as small things affecting us (no pun intended blink.gif ), I think it really depends on how secure the person was to begin with. Teenagers or children are likely to be more insecure because they're still discovering who they really are. Part of that discovery comes from cues from other people.


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tony64
post Jan 6 2006, 07:40 PM
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QUOTE (EvilSpoon @ Jan 6 2006, 06:58 PM)
Well, if you're going to take the stance of Durkheim, yes we are born with a blank slate...

Actually I'll edit this later, I have to go to the store to get some stuff to make dinner with. I guess I'm cooking tonight.
*

I was dragged up in life,but never blamed my upbringing.People are to quick to blame other people for undue influence.You are what you are !.Anarchy seems to be rife . I think parents play a role but mob culture is starting to rule , [nothing to do]. As teens we were the same ,but were not so gang led.
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Phyllis
post Jan 6 2006, 08:34 PM
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QUOTE (tony64 @ Jan 6 2006, 11:40 AM)
I was dragged up in life,but never blamed my upbringing.People are to quick to blame other people for undue influence.You are what you are !.Anarchy seems to be rife . I think parents play a role but mob culture is starting to rule , [nothing to do]. As teens we were the same ,but were not so gang led.
*

How you are raised plays a HUGE role in who you become. It's not entirely responsible, no, but it's inaccurate to say that it's "undue influence."


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tony64
post Jan 6 2006, 09:09 PM
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QUOTE (candice @ Jan 6 2006, 08:34 PM)
QUOTE (tony64 @ Jan 6 2006, 11:40 AM)
I was dragged up in life,but never blamed my upbringing.People are to quick to blame other people for undue influence.You are what you are !.Anarchy seems to be rife . I think parents play a role but mob culture is starting to rule , [nothing to do]. As teens we were the same ,but were not so gang led.
*

How you are raised plays a HUGE role in who you become. It's not entirely responsible, no, but it's inaccurate to say that it's "undue influence."
*


I was in care of local council from the age of four,ok,i had a anger about being left ,and i rebelled.But they did the best that was available,i did my utmost to [p] them off.In most people the natural reaction is fight the the people that mean the most,[attention].When people do not get the attention they go to thier friends next best thing.But i can say it was me that helped myself,my parents were not there,but i like to think that i helped myself,and did not blame anyone else.easy option?
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Phyllis
post Jan 6 2006, 09:23 PM
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You are just one person, so your situation can't really be applied to the entire population. Did you ever think that perhaps it was partially because you were abandoned and raised in a council house that you became the person you are? It had to have some bearing on why you decided to help yourself rather than blame others. If you'd been raised in a different council house, with a very different environment, you might have ended up completely different. No one can really say one way or the other.


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tony64
post Jan 6 2006, 09:38 PM
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QUOTE (candice @ Jan 6 2006, 09:23 PM)
You are just one person, so your situation can't really be applied to the entire population.  Did you ever think that perhaps it was partially because you were abandoned and raised in a council house that you became the person you are?  It had to have some bearing on why you decided to help yourself rather than blame others.  If you'd been raised in a different council house, with a very different environment, you might have ended up completely different.  No one can really say one way or the other.
*

No not council house ,[childrens home] .... orphan call it what you want.We had eighteen children all wanting the same attention from three adults,who where just doing a job.money and holidays easy !
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Phyllis
post Jan 6 2006, 09:59 PM
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Ah, I thought you said council house. The reason I thought this is because I wouldn't use that term on my own. I'd say orphanage. Maybe I misread your post.

Anyway, my point still stands about the environment you were raised in contributing to the person you became.


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tony64
post Jan 6 2006, 10:09 PM
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QUOTE (candice @ Jan 6 2006, 09:59 PM)
Ah, I thought you said council house.  The reason I thought this is because I wouldn't use that term on my own.  I'd say orphanage.  Maybe I misread your post.

Anyway, my point still stands about the environment you were raised in contributing to the person you became.
*

ok,i feel it did contribute,"i have a chip on shoulder",but people control their own destiny. pressure from outside influences have more of a role to play than manypeople are willing to admit;but may be thats easy! you argue good thanks[keeps the mind going]
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trunks_girl26
post Jan 8 2006, 11:58 PM
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QUOTE (tony64 @ Jan 6 2006, 10:09 PM)
QUOTE (candice @ Jan 6 2006, 09:59 PM)
Ah, I thought you said council house.  The reason I thought this is because I wouldn't use that term on my own.  I'd say orphanage.  Maybe I misread your post.

Anyway, my point still stands about the environment you were raised in contributing to the person you became.
*

ok,i feel it did contribute,"i have a chip on shoulder",but people control their own destiny. pressure from outside influences have more of a role to play than manypeople are willing to admit;but may be thats easy! you argue good thanks[keeps the mind going]
*



Forgive me if I read this wrong, but I was under the impression that all outside influences were considered a form of nurturing, if only because they're not part of the individual's genes.

And as to destiny, that seems to be a term that just sums up our responces to these various outside influences -nurture, if you will- as the will of a devine force.


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