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> ..I couldn't think of an appropriately descriptive title.., ..A diagnosis of sorts?
Yannick
post Nov 11 2010, 01:45 AM
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I could have written a short novel by this point
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Hey. Umm. I'm really not sure what I'm looking for in this thread. Subconsciously, a combination of advice, maybe a diagnosis, maybe just some reassurance and insight? I.. I don't know. I'm just really bad at talking about personal problems; probably worse than I am with dealing with others' problems, which some of you have probably realized I'm *terrible* at. Uh. I'll start. Eugh, awkward, expect choppy sentences. >_> Sorry if it.. gets long. The main bits are near the bottom, I just felt a background might be relevant. *shrug*

I am in high school. The drug scene at mine is.. well, pretty cool. That's probably because it's in the ghetto. Which is where the IB program comes in: kids capable of handling it are imported from all over the county to hide that all the standard kids are failing and balance the socio-economic status of the students. IB = AP + more crap, ergo IB > AP in both difficulty and merit. There's a chart somewhere comparing the two, but that's not important. The point.. of this horridly constructed paragraph, is that if you mix a bunch of college-bound constantly stressing kids with a druggie school, it's only so long before someone's like "Oh hey, that Adderall, huh?" I actually learned about it from one of my freshmen teachers, and any drug a teacher tells you is stupid is worth further research.

I've honestly never found amphetamines appealing. That's not a product of DARE brainwash; I got over that when I was about 12. I went from "HOW COULD YOU SMOKE POT? YOU'RE GONNA DIE!" to having an incredibly liberal outlook on substances in about a year. I just didn't understand why people would want to be awake for two weeks straight.

...Then I started reading Erowid trip reports about that funky d-amphetamine. The caffeine on caffeine sounded like, well hell, a miracle drug. The general gist of it, for non ADHD/ADD people was that it will max out your focus and just make everything really clear. Sleep becomes nonessential, you'll understand things you hadn't noticed previously, and so forth. One of my friends described writing an essay on it as it being like for those two hours, it's like only you and that essay exist. Freshman year was nearing an end; it was still a breeze, so, while it sounded like an incredibly enticing chemical, I felt no desire for it. Well, that's not entirely true. I wanted to try it to try it, but not to the extent of hunting down a seller and risking expulsion from the program for illicit nootropic usage. I actually tried convincing my mom I had ADD and getting a prescript, but that went over like hell, lol. (My school is stupid. There's a no tolerance illegal drug policy with a subsection on nootropics, or "smart drugs". Better stop selling chicken in the cafeteria, Wiki lists protein as a nootropic. ohmy.gif)

Fast forward through the summer and into sophomore (current) year. Two weeks before exams, I had this "God, I'm f*cked" attitude toward the upcoming nightmare. I knew some kids in some of my classes using Adderall, so bought some of the extended release tablets for a generous price. To make sure I wasn't allergic or anything, I went to the mall with my best friend, told him I was going to down one, and if anything happened to call 911 or something and just be honest with them. 'Cos, you know, dying isn't cool. Neither is getting in trouble, but one is considerably less of a b*tch than the other. A friend of my friend was also with us (he didn't know).

Now, we were in the mall, so I wasn't exactly expecting much mental stimulation. Big news, didn't encounter any. We delved into the Apple Store, looked up some puzzles, but, I mean, I either knew how to do them or didn't, much like in my non-Adderall life. Anyway, the only significant change I noticed (aside from absolutely no appetite) was that I.. was extremely social? Usually when I'm around people I don't know, I don't talk much unless there's something interesting to talk about. (Ironically, I'm perfectly comfortable debating strangers, yet simple "Oh, so what school do you go to? That's cool.." is hella difficult.) But yeah, extremely social. It's not even that this kid was interesting, talking was just.. easy.

Mall closed, went home. I'm pretty sure this was a Saturday night, because I wasn't tired and didn't feel inclined to force myself to go to bed. Instead, I decided to catch up on the dreaded Statistics I'd been avoiding. The way the class is structured involves little classwork, but loads of going home and self-teaching. Hadn't touched the book in ages, managed to get through an entire chapter. I didn't feel like I understood it any better than I did while not on Adderall, which was a bit of a let down, but I wrote this off as it being late; maybe I missed the kick in? Chapter got done, regardless. Coolbeans.

This was all going down during the week leading up to exams and exam week. I had a few borderline A's and B's in IBWH, IB Chem, and AP/IB Stats, so this was an important time period. It was time to give that Adderall another go.

...Again, the effects weren't satisfying. I wasn't understanding things any more that I usually did (honestly, this has never been and still isn't a problem for me. I suppose I was just expecting a sort of insight that Adderall didn't offer me), but I did find it easier to put up with work and the now no longer needed sleep was definitely advantageous. After staying up all night working, to avoid being a zombie in school, I redosed. Seven classes later, I realized that this definitely isn't an intelligence boost so many Erowid trippers report. I was *so* much more social, though. All the BS things I usually don't bother with, like the repetitive notes my French teacher makes us copy verbatim, the warm-up exercises in my math classes, color-coding English passages, sitting there and reading the history textbook, etc. were now just "Meh, I guess I'll do them." things. I wasn't more motivated: the combination of complete apathy, being awake, and having nothing better to do made me do things I'd normally consider not worth the energy. Consider it the equivalent of multiplying 3453453 by 34234 with paper and pen. You know you know how to do it, the practice isn't needed, and it's just a waste of time. It didn't benefit me at all, I just.. did it. And I still don't know why, lol. But oh my god was I social. It's common understanding that the bus in the morning = Izzy's music, homework, and nap time. Disturb me and we're cool, but people can just tell I have no interest in talking to them. "I'm busy, sorry." This has led to me making no bus friends that weren't my friends from elsewhere, but that morning oh my god was I *so* social. I made some new friends, and probably came off as something other than that anti-social nerdy kid for once. (It wasn't a crusade for validation from my peers, it just happened.)

Now, this hadn't gone unnoticed by me. It wasn't a side effect I was expecting, by any means. I don't think I've ever read about it. I suffer from "B*tchy when tired" as much as the next person, but I feel (yet have no empirical explanation for) that this had more to do with the Adderall than just the wakefulness it bestowed in me. Literally every good conversation I've had with my mom since starting this school year (which amounts to what, three?), I've been under the influence of Adderall. I feel so bad about it, too. She tries talking to me, and in an agitated tone I'm like "I'm busy", and then I'll automatically and sincerely apologize because I realize what a douche I sound like. Then it's too late, and the tension will suck for a few hours. Instead of fixing it, I'll keep doing homework, go to sleep, hope things are better in the morning, and hey, they usually are. Lather, rinse, repeat. Stress. Ignore people. Homework.

This has led to a little hypothesis of my own, which I can't exactly carry out an experiment for, but maybe there's some validity to it? I'm curious if anyone has seen studies done. Academically, I've always triumphed. Even the classes that I just want to drop already (French, history, ...and English (which I love, but find comparatively purposeless given what I'll be majoring in)) have never been a problem when you look past me just not wanting to put in the time and do the work. Perhaps, then, rather than being the academic steroid the bulk of society considers it, Adderall simply steps in where people fall short. The struggling high school kid will note a significant increase in brain power while the slacking yet smart introvert will have a guise affable amiability. ..This is literally based on one observation, mine, possible biased by denial, and then twenty or so Erowid reports I've read through. I know that quantifies to crap. Nevertheless, based on the writing style of the trip reporters, those appearing to be more intelligent report questionable success. The people who it seems to work for, seem, well, like they were struggling to understand things to begin with. Is this plausible? Thoughts?

*That* said, I've finally gotten to this part. From every singe report I've read, Adderall only has the desired effects on people who don't have ADD/ADHD. I've read two or three reports from ADD/ADHD users that realize it works so differently for the people they sell it to. It upsets them that they can't have that. It grieves me that I don't experience it, either. I've narrowed the cause down to four possibilities.

1. What I said above. Maybe it improves what it needs to, and if someone isn't struggling academically, the brain will neglect this region make it target what it deems more important. (Disclaimer: Again, I have no chemical, neurological, or biological basis for this claim. My understanding of how drugs effect the brain is amateur at best, and I'm not claiming otherwise. If this gets ripped to shreds by someone, so be it, but realize that given my observations, it makes sense that I've come up with this. So, like, if I'm totally wrong, that's cool, lemme know why because I'm honestly interested, but please don't be all "Lawl, NOOB" about it. >_>)

2. ..Maybe I do have ADD/ADHD or something analogous? This would explain what I'm considering impotence, and *shrug*. I was kind of wild as a child (due mostly to boredom), but over all I'd consider myself pretty mellow? This alone might throw that out. I have looked into it a bit, and I don't exhibit signs of ADD/ADHD behavior. I even looked up how to fake it to try to convince my mom I had it. But, I don't know, maybe I have some other disorder that I'm not familiar with? You're all an intelligent bunch, it's possible you know of something?

3. Hah, maybe I really just am not sleeping enough. (But, like, there's so much I have to do. "Just go to bed earlier" isn't feasible. High school has taught me to be appreciative of every snooze I get and feel indebted to the teachers (<3 my physics, pre-calc comp, and stat teachers) that will let me sleep through and do homework in their classes on occasion. I leave at 6 every morning and don't get home until 6 pm three days a week. The other two days are 6-3. (Two hours of commute daily. My school doesn't start at six.) Throw on the homework that comes with seven academics, and.. it's overwhelming. I'm really trying not to come off as a lazy (through I am prone to procrastination) kid abusing drugs to get through high school. This is.. just honestly some hard stuff.

4. It's extended release. I've never taken more than one of those orange 30 mg extended release capsules at a time. I've actually halved some of the dosages because I just need caffeine without the jitters for a few hours, not all night. Would getting instant release or upping the dosage of the XR possibly give me the "JESUS I JUST DIVIDED BY ZERO, FORMED A QUADRUPLE BOND, AND DIVIDED MATRICES" holy grail I'm questing for? I'd love to see the universe with a feeling of omniscience, but it's possible my expectations are too insane. Maybe I can't fix quantum mechanics or prove some cool currently nonexistent math theorem now, but there's just something so attractive about being able to sit down with a pen and paper and work it out. Even with the boost I'm looking for, I'm probably not going to have the mathematical or scientific backing to do what I want to do (one day tongue.gif), but.. I just want to know what it *feels* like. (Altered perception in general is just something I've found fascinating. I like feeling the world inside out, hearing colors, seeing sounds, being tickled by music. It's quite poetic, and people just honestly don't have a sense of exactly how subjective our world is until they've completely muddled their state of consciousness. It's so inexplicable, and the cosmos just become astronomically more magnificent when your exposure to them is altered. ..But I digress, got really off topic here, lol.)

What I've been building up to is essentially this:

Whether I've gotten the effects I want to or not, Adderall has serious positive impacts on me whenever I use it. I'm by and large happier and much more competent of dealing with people while on it. I wouldn't say I was depressed, and if I was I wouldn't say the temporary effects would purge me of this problem, but it assuages so much stress. I use it rarely, aside from exam week when I took like 4 in a row, today (physics hell week) is my third time doing it, the other being the mall and once to cram for history (which failed, lawl. I blame syuu's old FB status tongue.gif). Like, I just finished telling this chick that she should join the math team so we can talk more often. She's one of the bus friends I made the last time I was on it mentioned above. She said I made her day because I thought she could make the math team. I love how I don't need to make effort to talk to people, it just.. happens when I'm on it. Instead of contemplating every word, I just know what to say. I love it. I hate not knowing how to talk to people anymore.

Basically, idk, is it worth telling my mom (who was against Prop 19 and has told me she'd disown me if I ever did drugs. To her happiness, I've informed her I would never dream of such atrocious behavior and have sited academic success as proof that I don't. Thank god we're German and drinking doesn't count, because I was so unsubtle about it when I went through that phase >_>) that I illegally obtained something she specifically told me not to, even if I present and make a spectacle of the obvious benefits I've experienced? I feel like if I start using it habitually (as of yet undecided), it's something my doctors should be aware of. I don't want to be in a situation where I die because of an incomplete medical history. I can just imagine the combination of Adderall and some medicine I need leading to heart overload and my body just crashing. Maybe that's too much of a pessimistic outlook, and while a lot of things are prescription that needn't be, amphetamines have been linked to heart attacks, high blood pressure, and other things I don't want. My mom is so anti-drug that I can just imagine her disappointment, though. I mean, the disown thing is a clear hyperbole and she's stuck with me for two more years anyway.. but.. idk. I just don't know. I also don't want to be accused of this not being the real me. I can just imagine that convo, eugh. "I want to talk to you, not the drugged up you." "Mom.. it's not like that. The people you talk to on anti-depressants and bi-polar meds aren't 'drugged up'. That's them how they want to be." "*doesn't listen, throws my stuff away*"

Eugh. I hate not knowing. D: Obtaining them isn't a problem, and I really don't want this to come off as drug-seeking behavior. If something *works* for people (be it anti-depressants, MDeffingA, whatevs), they should have the right to express a legitimate interest to help themselves and get a prescript without fear of screwing up their lives because the coppers don't have better things to do than nail people for possession of scheduled substances. I'm me, and I think most of you know that I consider our current drug laws ridiculous anyway, but.. eugh, I'm not using it to get high, is my point. My mom should be able to understand that, right?

Help. =/

(Haha, wow, 2800 words. I think I lied when I said I didn't have time for NaNoWriMo. >_>)


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Every atom in your body came from a star that exploded. And, the atoms in your left hand probably came from a different star than your right hand. It really is the most poetic thing I know about physics: You are all stardust. You couldnít be here if stars hadnít exploded, because the elements - the carbon, nitrogen, oxygen, iron, all the things that matter for evolution and for life - werenít created at the beginning of time. They were created in the nuclear furnaces of stars, and the only way for them to get into your body is if those stars were kind enough to explode. So, forget God. The stars died so that you could be here today. ~Lawrence Krauss
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I_am_the_best
post Nov 11 2010, 01:30 PM
Post #2


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By that logic, Izzy, I should become an alcoholic.


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"Music is a moral law. It gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination, a charm to sadness, gaiety and life to everything. It is the essence of order, and leads to all that is good, just and beautiful, of which it is the invisible, but nevertheless dazzling, passionate, and eternal form." - Plato
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Daria
post Nov 11 2010, 03:44 PM
Post #3


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I started to think of a long rambling response, but I will condense it to this:

-There are better drugs to get you out of your reality tunnel than Adderall.
-Relying on substances on a daily basis isn't a good idea. Those who need anti-depressants or drugs to help them with bi-polar disorder are prescribed them by a doctor and although that doesn't mean that they are perfect and good for you, it does mean it comes with a slightly better case for taking them.
-If you believe that your mum will not react well, and that it can cause more issues between the two of you, then don't tell her. Make sure, however, that a close friend of yours is informed about what you are doing and has the ability to contact your mother/ doctor if and when an issue arises. That way your details can be passed on, but only when needs be.

It seems like you like the effects it has, and are wanting justification for taking it. Taking anything for long periods of time is never a good thing, I wouldn't suggest it.

When I took Adderall, I was really really tired and at a gig. I got nothing from it other than the ability to keep my eyes wide open when I could easily fall asleep leaning against the wall!


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elphaba2
post Nov 11 2010, 05:50 PM
Post #4


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Honestly, this reads to me like you're REALLY SURPRISED that drugs aren't like what people say they're like. Welcome, my child. Mushrooms will not make you see magical purple unicorns, Adderall will not make you smarter, marijuana will not fill you with murder-lust (aha Reefer Madness). People talk a lot of sh*t about drugs. People lie. People confabulate. And some people, God help them, really think they saw magical purple unicorns.

To repeat the darizard, don't take it daily. No one likes a daily dependence. Some people have to put up with it in order to live their lives. Furthermore, you're going to see that sociability wane. Drugs have vastly differing effects when taken habitually versus occasionally and amphetamine in perticalur. I'm sure you know its mode of action so I don't need to elaborate, but essentially continued use causes a decrease in pre-synaptic dopamine transporter molecules (amphetamine blocks the transporter AND does its job for it, all busting vesicles open and releasing dopamine all over the place, rendering the transporter totally useless = your brain synthesizes fewer of them = your DA drastically drops the minute you begin to withdraw.) Which can make a healthy brain look like the brain of a major depressive. There also tend to be persistent decreases in frontal cortical function after prolonged use.

I'm not saying Adderall will make you depressed in the long run! I'm not saying that at all! I'm quoting from a series of studies which examined (for example) monkeys, meth-heads, bored housewives, mice and schoolchildren. Every brain is unique. You may not ever see these effects.

But, if you're overall disillusioned with the drug's effect (except for the sociability aspect, which is pretty amazing, I agree) why on earth would you be contemplating daily use?

It sounds to me like you're mildly anxious in social situations. Me too. I get all up in my head and it's usually easier to read a book or sleep or go do something else than talk to people. With Adderall, there's a kind of safety, letting the drug take over. You can just sit back and enjoy. Amphetamines are an awesome anxiolytic, but what happens when you don't have them? At the end of the day, it's you and your brain, dude. So do what makes you happiest with the brain you've got.


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Hobbes
post Nov 11 2010, 05:55 PM
Post #5


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I cannot tell you whether the effects you are feeling are normal, unusual, or due to some other underlying issues. I cannot tell you, because I do not know. All I can say is that, as with ALL drugs, everybody reacts in a different way. Paracetomol can ease your pain, have no effect whatsoever, or kill you. And much inbetween. Personally, I wouldn't take anything aside from off-the-shelf medication without first consulting my GP. This might be because I'm too straight-cut, or conformist, or a coward, or it might just be because I don't wanna get sick due to not being able to make an educated guess (at the very least) about how my body will react to something new I shove in its system.

QUOTE
eugh, I'm not using it to get high, is my point. My mom should be able to understand that, right?

Except... you are. "High" is a pretty broad term and, sure, it might not rank up there with the supposed experiences declared by users of various illegal recreational drugs, but you are enjoying a new ability in social situations - a sudden reduction in that previous introversion that might have once existed. You are less inhibited, and at ease. And that's somewhat indicative of other drugs. And, ultimately, you like it more than the "standard you"... thus, it is a "high".

Sure, alcohol and nicotine and caffeine and many other substances can cause a similar effect, and they are all legal (to some extent). But they are taken because they either provide some kind of enjoyment (the high!), or they are addictive.

From what I understand of your post, you initially tried the medication as a way to improve concentration and ability in situations like examinations, essays, etc. A way to focus, so that you may achieve more at times of stress. And, ultimately, it didn't work in this manner. But it sounds like you are now using it because of the positive effects it has had on your social demeanour. Again, I'd argue it as being taken as a high.

QUOTE
3. Hah, maybe I really just am not sleeping enough.

Almost certainly true - judging by the times associated with your Facebook status updates, or posts on here, etc. However, I know that your workload may be impossible to complete without reducing your sleeping hours (especially with long commutes to school/college), and so it might be something you have to just "get through". Or there might be a lot of social sacrifices you'll have to make in order to use almost ALL your time for academia. But it'll be worth it in the end, I'm sure.

However, if you cannot give 100% to all of your subjects because you simply do not have the time available to devote to them, is it worth having all your work suffer every so slightly in order to accomodate them all? Maybe it would make more sense to drop one (if possible), and therefore free up more time to put into producing the excellent-work you are capable of, for all of the remaining subjects?

---

The key point here, though, is that you realised that you ARE capable of having these social interactions. It is just that the drug was the thing that pushed you to do it. However, it ISNT the drug that spoke, and behaved. Nor is it the drug that taught you how to behave in the right way to form new friendships or relationships. It merely took away a nervousness or introvertion that existed, preventing you from doing these things. Why can't you do these things without the drug? Well, to be honest, you can. Chances are, like so many of us, you find those social situations with strangers - or whoever - difficult, because of some form of fear. Maybe you are like me, and have a "worst case scenario"-type of mind, or you just worry about what to say, or how to say it. But NOW... you know you can do it. You needn't fear the imagined situation. It has existed for you. And it was great (you made friends!). So, the drug may have helped you to discover it. But make sure it now remains as just that initial help, and not a reliance upon it.

You know you are capable of functioning in those situations; knowing what to say. The drug didn't make you smarter, or funnier, it just let you BE that because it removed the fear. A fear that no longer needs to exist.

As Daria said:
QUOTE
It seems like you like the effects it has, and are wanting justification for taking it. Taking anything for long periods of time is never a good thing, I wouldn't suggest it


I second that.

It would be extremely sensible to go to your doctor about it, and tell him/her that you are taking it, yes. But, it would be more sensible to just... NOT take it. If you feel you need something like it, then the doctor might be able to point you in the right direction... but talking to someone, in my opinion, is a better initial option that popping a pill.

QUOTE
I just don't know. I also don't want to be accused of this not being the real me. I can just imagine that convo, eugh. "I want to talk to you, not the drugged up you." "Mom.. it's not like that. The people you talk to on anti-depressants and bi-polar meds aren't 'drugged up'. That's them how they want to be." "*doesn't listen, throws my stuff away*"


In the majority of cases, Izzy, you CAN be who you WANT to be, without it being based on a chemical. And, ultimately, reliance upon the drug will never truly solve the things about yourself that you dislike. There are more sensible, life-affirming, steps you can take that will actually provide you more insight into who you ARE, rather than taking a drug to hide the thing you don't want.

I've used this analogy in other discussions this week but: With what you know, medically/psychologically about yourself at the moment, taking the drug is as effective as taking painkillers for a broken leg. Sure, it supresses the pain, but the root cause is still there and will emerge once more.

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Incidentally, because of my own fear of offending people:

I am aware that there are people (I know a few) who do require regular use of a drug in order to maintain some sort of stability in their life, psychologically. I am not disputing this at all. And for those people, chances are they have visited several doctors, psychological professionals, etc., in order to come upon their current solution.

But if, like Izzy, you haven't gone through the process of trying to reach a diagnosis and exploring other options, taking a drug early on is not the solution. Especially not without sufficient advice.


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Daria
post Nov 11 2010, 08:32 PM
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I second Hobbes and 'Phaba.
I also want to add a point to the mention of daily usage and the differing in effects. Recently I have been taking Tramadol to manage the abdominal pain I've been suffering from. Tramadol is superfun if you take it infrequently- it makes you feel like you're on ecstasy. You want to snuggle up to people, my synaesthesia is heightened and it's just melty-gorgeous. However, for me, it also comes with side-effects of shivering, all-over itching, and constipation. (Side-effects vary greatly between people.) I have been taking it for about four weeks straight now. It's an opiate and your body gets very addicted very quickly. There was one day where I took a different painkiller instead and I had withdrawal symptoms- nausea, headaches, fatigue, itches, anxiety. As I have taken it so much, I don't get the nice fuzziness anymore- I occasionally get the itches, and increasingly I find myself anxious in situations where I would normally function A-ok- anxiety is another side-effect of this drug.

Even things that seem awesome to start with can be crap if you use them frequently.


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We are unraveling our navels so that we may ingest the sun.

DARIA IZ GOOD ON TOAST

TOAST IZ GOOD ON DARIA
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Mata
post Nov 11 2010, 09:17 PM
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/\ Everything they said, with a cherry on top.

Pretty much everyone who takes a drug on a regular basis would rather not be taking it. Usually the point of drugs that effect the personality is to help the individual learn how to work that way without the drugs, so they can slowly wean themselves off of the drugs. As Hobbes said, these drugs have demonstrated that you can be social - that's still you doing it, even if the drugs help - so now you know you can, go do it without the drugs. If you feel the drugs to help and you are determined to take them then reduce the dosage and learn how to do it all by yourself. You can and are capable of doing this.

Again, as others have said, tell someone you are doing this, maybe even multiple people. By the sound of things it would be a bad idea to tell your mother. Perhaps whenever you take the drug you should wrap the packet with a note saying what it is you've taken - in case of emergencies this would stand a good chance of being found and may save your life. And yes, amphetamines are bad for you for all the reasons you list and the others that Elph said. I'd add to that, that if you have had emotional or stability issues in the past then adding an extra potion into the mix probably isn't your best idea.

It's good you've discovered a new side of your personality, but I just can't see any long term use of illegal (or most legal) substances as a good idea. Yep, that's the boring answer, but it's really the truth.

Also, getting busted for drugs can really f*ck up your life on a long term basis. That's worth thinking about.


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gerbilfromhell
post Nov 14 2010, 02:23 AM
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It's really tempting to want to use amphetamines regularly when they improve your social life and give you self-confidence, even if that's not what you were going for. A friend of mine had that happen to him with amphetamines, although his situation was different in that he had been trying to take ecstasy and ended up with something amphetamine-based, probably meth. But anyways, afterwords he was considering trying to get an adderall prescription because of how confident he was socializing. But, as has been said, if you want to be more social, it should be significantly easier now that you've *already been more social*. In the case of my friend, we convinced him not to get himself an adderall prescription, and he ended up just generally being less socially awkward since it was more a matter of trying to repeat/adapt how he'd been on uppers rather than just trying to be confident.

I'd definitely agree that, if something seems to affect you positively that it's worth exploring, but it's always necessary to keep in mind how best to get what you're looking for. MDMA, the other example you gave, can certainly help people; it was originally used for relationship counseling, is being looked into to treat PTSD and (as less-extreme extensions of the two) is great for helping any relationship or getting over a phobia or trauma. But, it was never used *regularly*, let alone daily, when being used for those purposes. Not that there aren't benefits to long-term usage as well of certain things (another friend of mine has taken mushrooms once every six months or so for the past six or so years for what he calls a 'mental recharge,' and it does seem to do him good), but the issue is frequency rather than simply duration. If you're looking for the behavior or personality changes you've already seen when you've been taking adderall, try taking a month or two without any.

Also, as has been said, dopamine transmitters are good things to have. If you think you have ADD, go to a doctor (and, since I know how absurdly readily many doctors will prescribe ADD medication, if it is determined that you do in fact have ADD/ADHD, look into drugs not based on amphetamine like adderall or di-amphetamine like Ritalin). That and, after enough usage of adderall, if you don't actually have ADD, you may likely find you're *less* able to concentrate on any long-term work, or that it takes you significantly longer to do it. The paper at my school ran an article on student adderall use a year ago, which was pretty poorly written but did have a good comment from a guy who said that after awhile it became very hit-or-miss; he could take some and write an amazing paper or he could take some and accidentally spend all night doing some part of the research but not actually doing any writing.
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Pikasyuu
post Nov 15 2010, 06:40 AM
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as an aside re: your medical history, if you do start taking it daily, (which would be f*cking pointless unless you actually need it, which you clearly don't..it's kind of like saying, 'this is mediocre. it barely does anything for me. i think i'll randomly f*ck up my brain chemistry via what elphaba said for no reason.' are you that bored? debate more.) list it? they have no way of knowing whether or not it had been prescribed for you in the past or by another doctor - and if they do, they clearly don't usually check. when i went to my current doctor, i was doing anything and going anywhere to keep a regular, non-abusive dose of tramadol a part of my daily regimen and it still is, because it significantly improves my life in a major way. i listed it on my medical history. i didn't have to say, oh my stepdad gave me a couple once and then a girl at school didn't want her ENTIRE PRESCRIPTION so i got it there and then i told a doctor i was prescribed it (when i wasn't) by a former doctor, and so he continued my prescription. i basically sat down and told her, i'm on this, it works for me, i'd like a running prescription from you for an average of two a day, and guess what? i have one.
however, you need to be responsible with drugs you can develop a tolerance to. as some people know/have to listen to me whine and bitch, tramadol is a combination synthetic opiate antidepressant. because of its opiate properties, i will develop a tolerance and two will no longer do the job. what i do is let myself run the course throughout the month (within reason) to the point where i get up to three at a time, maybe four max if i can't sleep. then as i begin to get within, say, ten left, i drop from 3 to 2 and 2 to 1 over the course of a few days and then go 24-72 hours without taking any. i do have to deal with opiate withdrawal symptoms in addition to antidepressant withdrawal symptoms, which is kind of a roulette and some times can be much, much tougher than others, but it's something i have to do to keep enjoying the benefits of this drug without letting myself get so addicted that i have to take half the bottle at a time. anything that messes with your brain chemistry and offers a tolerance is something you need to be responsible with, because i don't care how smart or mature you think you are, that kind of thing can spiral out of control in the blink of an eye.

but seriously, i think taking adderall that you aren't prescribed without understanding how it interacts with other drugs you may take when the risk is in no way proportional to the reward is..well..stupid. like everyone else said, if you think you have add/adhd, ask a doctor.


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Daria
post Nov 15 2010, 09:33 PM
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QUOTE (Pikasyuu @ Nov 15 2010, 07:40 AM) *
however, you need to be responsible with drugs you can develop a tolerance to. as some people know/have to listen to me whine and bitch, tramadol is a combination synthetic opiate antidepressant.


Huh, I didn't know it's an antidepressant. I've always taken it as a painkiller and found it to increase any background levels of anxiety I've had lurking about when I'm ill.

QUOTE
... to keep enjoying the benefits of this drug without letting myself get so addicted that i have to take half the bottle at a time.

When I first start taking it as a painkiller, I only usually need one every 4-6 hours. It makes me pretty fuzzy, woozy, feel a bit high, heightens my synaesthesia, makes me sleep more and ruins my concentration. This time I've been taking it for three weeks (got a new prescription today after already having gone through two boxes of 100 pills), and it's got to the point where I have to take two for it to do anything and I don't get any of the other lovely side effects. Just the constipation, sleepiness and occasional itches...
The withdrawal from this "being ill" is going to be horrible.


/ramble about me


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Pikasyuu
post Nov 16 2010, 08:52 PM
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Usually what you can expect from the withdrawal is little spoonfuls of the opiate family and a big backhand from the antidepressant family. I usually get the shakes, the serious insomnia, some very unpleasant sweats, the feeling of being 'rickety' or old, and occasionally very serious depression. Try marathoning a tv show and making sure you're always somewhere cool. Depending on how many you're taking, a break of 48 hours (since it was in your system, not since your last dosage - it has a half-life of 12 hours.) should do the trick and lower you back to one.


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last updated 11/05
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Daria
post Nov 19 2010, 12:45 PM
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So far it's been feeling hot/cold/everything in between, sparkly vision now and again, shakey, insomnia, a stomach that feels like it's doing backflips and getting sudden moments of sadness or anxiety.


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