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> St George Car Flags, We're England. WE WILL LOSE
WeeJ
post Jun 14 2004, 06:24 PM
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I'm pretty sure I'm going to be called un-patriotic for saying this, but these St George Flags clinging onto people's windows for grim death look seriously crap. I'm going to point out a few things that most people will think is somewhat grumpy of me, but you'll get over it tongue.gif

1/ No one bothered with these St George's flags on St George's day. If you wants to be patriotic, at least do it on the right day.

2/ If you feel the need to do something patriotic, please don't plaster you're car in poop merchanise that will fly away and hit other drivers when you open your window.

3/ We're England. We lose at every sporting event. Ever.

4/ I'll be glad when all this football malarky is dead and burried. Its sending me bonkers mad.gif


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Cath Sparrow
post Jun 14 2004, 06:53 PM
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Yay! Weej! Those flags are bugging the hell out of me!! And I have NO!!! interest in football! dry.gif


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post Jun 14 2004, 06:59 PM
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mooooooooooopo
post Jun 14 2004, 07:15 PM
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Bump

Yay! Its not just me who hates the flags and thinks football is evil biggrin.gif .

Anyone who disagrees care to explain how people should be paid so much just because they are better at running around in a field kicking an imitation pigs bladder about (and inspiring hatred and random violence at the same time)?


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the lil' pie...
post Jun 15 2004, 08:13 AM
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HEY! ohmy.gif

yes, it's not the right occasion for patriotism, by definition. but at least it's bringing the country together. this in itself means a lot less hatred and random violence within the UK for a while smile.gif

and sure, maybe some of it's taken across to Europe, but that's a small minority of peoples. most of them are quite happy just to get together and, i quote, "watch the beautiful game" (and/or talk about it, play it etc.) (oh, and drink. lots of beer smile.gif)

moop raises a good point though, i do think footballers get paid a lot too much. think of all the doctors, scientists, teachers and so on. they do something that is infinitely more beneficial to society, yet they're paid only a percentage of a footballer's matchly wage A MONTH....i think....

and other entertainers, comedians and the like, don't get paid that much either...so yeah, it's a bit wrong for them to be paid so much, but what are you gonna do? *shrugs*

we don't always lose, either. the rugby?? cricket's going well(ish) this year as well...we held off france and only lost due to two fatal injury time mistakes...hell, i think we're in with a chance!! biggrin.gif

yay for football!!! tongue.gif


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Pixelgoth
post Jun 15 2004, 12:02 PM
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I agree but every single car I see with them on is crammed full of Chavs! rolleyes.gif

I mean I am all for supporting England.....even though stupid Heskey threw the game for us on Sunday dry.gif You get paid that much to run around a field for England you should bloody well do it better than that!!! *wags finger* I took my England badge off my bag in protest!

In fact....don't get me started about it..... mad.gif


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Mutilation
post Jun 15 2004, 12:32 PM
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QUOTE (WeeJ @ Jun 14 2004, 07:24 PM)
3/ We're England. We lose at every sporting event. Ever.

Errm, who won the rugby world cup?
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Pixelgoth
post Jun 15 2004, 12:40 PM
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QUOTE (Mutilation @ Jun 15 2004, 01:32 PM)
Errm, who won the rugby world cup?

AND the Cricket to NZ! tongue.gif 3 times! First time in over 20 years mind but we did it none the less! Only wish we could do better in EURO 2004 dry.gif

*looks around for something to kneecap Heskey with*


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Mutilation
post Jun 15 2004, 12:43 PM
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IT'S THOSE FRENCH*! GAHHHHH! DOWN WITH THE FRENCH*! DOWN WITH NAPOLEON!

Well, we were fighting them for 100 years (well actually 1337-1453).

*Except all French on the Matazone board or friends of people who read this. Or just replace French with Zidane.
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Pixelgoth
post Jun 15 2004, 12:45 PM
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QUOTE (Mutilation @ Jun 15 2004, 01:43 PM)
IT'S THOSE FRENCH*! GAHHHHH! DOWN WITH THE FRENCH*! DOWN WITH NAPOLEON!

I've only ever known 1 nice French person. Isn't that a sad state of affairs? sad.gif


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Mata
post Jun 15 2004, 12:53 PM
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I've met loads... Oh, and now I remember, technically I'm a quarter French (only technically, my grandmother was born there, although she wasn't actually French).

QUOTE
at least it's bringing the country together.

So did the Harry Potter books, but they didn't generally cause hundreds of people to riot in city centres.

The amount of money in the sport is silly, but if people want to enjoy watching it then that's up to them. Of course, I wish they'd do it in ways that didn't interfere with things I'm interested in... Such as walking down the street in the evening and feeling safe...

The thing that really puzzles me is exactly why football seems to make certain groups of the British so damn violent... In fact it seems to be mainly the English who have this reaction. Also, what's the point in rioting in your own city? What's that going to prove?

In Croydon, where I grew up, there were the largest riots in the UK, involving 400 people. That's my home town folks. Is it any wonder I took an interest in the martial arts?


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leopold
post Jun 15 2004, 04:46 PM
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Jen, you are one right grumpy mare! tongue.gif

QUOTE
1/ No one bothered with these St George's flags on St George's day. If you wants to be patriotic, at least do it on the right day.

I completely agree! However, it's bloody difficult to do when nobody remembers what day it's on (APRIL 23rd, PEOPLE!!!) and you can't get the flags anywhere. Really, this country is pretty crap when it comes to patron saints, cos everyone would rather support the booze-fest that is St Patrick's day. I'd swear, but I'd only upset my fellow mods... And anyway, why not fly the cross whenever we want to? In the USA, it's practically a criminal offense NOT to fly the flag! Well, that's probably overstating a little, but almost everyone over there flies their flag. WHY CAN'T WE???? Rest assured, I will be saving my monster flag for next time our patron saint's day ticks round.

QUOTE
2/ If you feel the need to do something patriotic, please don't plaster you're car in poop merchanise that will fly away and hit other drivers when you open your window.

It's my car, I'll do what I want with it tongue.gif

QUOTE
3/ We're England. We lose at every sporting event. Ever.

Gross generalisation, and completely wrong to boot. Okay, so we've not won the World Cup since 1966, we've not had a Wimbledon champion since 1977, but there's more to it than that. At least we qualify for these things, which puts us ahead of many nations. And bear in mind that we can put together teams that can do stuff when we have one of the smallest populations of any country, it's a pretty good achievement.

QUOTE
4/ I'll be glad when all this football malarky is dead and burried. Its sending me bonkers mad.gif

Yeah... and I'll be the same when Big Brother finishes. At least the footy will be over in three weeks (and it's only just started) but we have to put up with that group of misfits for another two months! GAH!!!!

Actually, I don't feel like arguing why we should get behind OUR OWN NATIONAL TEAM! The fact you don't like football shouldn't really deter you from appreciating that there's someone out there doing us proud (or at least trying to). I don't particularly like tennis, but I'll still be rooting for Tim Henman in a few weeks from now. I dunno, I just get the feeling that national pride has been flushed down the toilet when I listen to some people...


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WeeJ
post Jun 15 2004, 06:17 PM
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I dunno Leo, don't you think all this flag flying looks kind of...thuggish?
Fair play to anyone who likes football, its just bleedin' everywhere at the minute! At least Big Brother (as crap as it may be) isn't splattered on every tv advert, magazine page, billboard and radio station across the country tongue.gif

I'm all for patriotism, but I just don't 'do' football.

(And you gotta admit, its very very rare for England to come home with a victory. And when we do, the whole country goes crazy go nuts because of that same reason tongue.gif


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Pixelgoth
post Jun 16 2004, 03:52 PM
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Sorry Leo but I have to disagree. The England football team, so far, aren't doing us proud (especially Heskey! dry.gif). I'd love to see them do better. I'd love to see them perform as well as the cricketers and the rugby players this year but we can't have it all.

Don't knock BB! tongue.gif This year has been the most entertaining yet. I usually can't stand it but I'm hooked biggrin.gif

If you wanna attach a tacky flag to your car (or even two for that matter) then that's your prerogative but personally I think it's just that, tacky tongue.gif There are nicer ways of supporting your country. I have an England badge, small discrete and looks lovely next to the LGG ones biggrin.gif At the moment it's in my draw as I have yet to decide whether they deserve my support dry.gif

laugh.gif


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CommieBastard
post Jun 16 2004, 04:06 PM
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QUOTE (leopold @ Jun 15 2004, 05:46 PM)
Actually, I don't feel like arguing why we should get behind OUR OWN NATIONAL TEAM! The fact you don't like football shouldn't really deter you from appreciating that there's someone out there doing us proud (or at least trying to). I don't particularly like tennis, but I'll still be rooting for Tim Henman in a few weeks from now. I dunno, I just get the feeling that national pride has been flushed down the toilet when I listen to some people...

I don't know that they're my team. I mean, they're from the same country my mother decided to move to and in which I live because I'm not yet old or independent enough to decide for myself where I want to live. And sure, there are plenty of lovely things about this country, but there are just as many about, say, France, Germany or America.

I actually prefer it when England doesn't win - if they do, I have to endure drunken loudmouths chanting in the streets while I'm trying to sleep. Nor do I understand feeling proud when somebody else has done something impressive - that may just be me, though.


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leopold
post Jun 17 2004, 12:18 PM
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QUOTE (CommieBastard @ Jun 16 2004, 05:06 PM)
I don't know that they're my team. I mean, they're from the same country my mother decided to move to and in which I live because I'm not yet old or independent enough to decide for myself where I want to live. And sure, there are plenty of lovely things about this country, but there are just as many about, say, France, Germany or America.

But you were born in this country, the one your own mother decided to move to before she gave birth to you. Doesn't that mean anything to you?

I'd try and argue my point more, but to be honest I can't be bothered. I'm never going to gain any ground while I keep hearing things like "I'm not truly English, my grandmother was half Ukranian". Well, here's a flash! The UK has been invaded so many times in it's history that it's mathematically almost impossible for anyone to be a pure-bred Briton. Even those whose ancestors have been here for centuries could trace their history back far enough and discover some Italian or Norse or whatever in their bloodline. And as for all the crap about the flag being racist and xenophobic - let's all look to the 90-ish% of Americans that fly their flag with pride and see how the people of the USA believe in their country (if not their government), or to the Scots who fly their flag proudly, and let's all feel bad about how terribly unpatriotic we English are.

And okay, the car flags are a bit tacky. So what? We can't always frown on doing things that are deemed tasteless or frivolous, otherwise we'd never have any fun (not to mention that Blackpool, Gran Canaria, Ibiza and Las Vegas would cease to exist). Yes, I have a pair of car flags. So what? I'm having a bit of fun and I don't give a rat's arse if people don't like it, frankly! There's a lot worse things I could be getting up to.

For the record, Pixie, I thought the team played pretty well, especially in defence, and it was two stupid errors at the death that blew our chance to beat the (arguably) best team in the tournament. Owen's not looking too sharp, though, and don't get me started on Heskey (mad.gif), but the rest of them were in fine form. Rest assured I will be relaxing with a couple of brewskis, my good lady and the kids to watch our boys against the Swiss tonight.


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Pixelgoth
post Jun 17 2004, 01:37 PM
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QUOTE (leopold @ Jun 17 2004, 01:18 PM)
Yes, I have a pair of car flags. So what? I'm having a bit of fun and I don't give a rat's arse if people don't like it, frankly! There's a lot worse things I could be getting up to.

For the record, Pixie, I thought the team played pretty well, especially in defence, and it was two stupid errors at the death that blew our chance to beat the (arguably) best team in the tournament. Owen's not looking too sharp, though, and don't get me started on Heskey (mad.gif), but the rest of them were in fine form. Rest assured I will be relaxing with a couple of brewskis, my good lady and the kids to watch our boys against the Swiss tonight.

*looks around for evidence of what crawled up Leo's arse and died* tongue.gif

Seriously mate, I don't understand why you're getting so worked up unsure.gif

The team did play well. I agree. But it isn't about 1 person making a mistake. They play as a team they need to accept defeat as a team. I support Spurs and King's one of ours. He played exceptionally. However, look back at France '98. Beckham was sent off and we lost. Everyone blamed Beckham for that one and forgot about the other 10 players rolleyes.gif They all played badly and we lost. It was a combination of a lot of factors. Some people deserve praise and some don't. I was simply blaming Heskey and James for being idiots and making silly mistakes that, quite frankly, they should know better about.

Also I'm entitled to my opinion about those flags being tacky as are you. I just seem to see them on tacky old cars. I never said you couldn't have one or two or twenty for that matter. Your choice and opinion. I wasnt saying you were tacky and I wasn't the only one saying they were nasty either. I know quite a few people on and off the board that think they are horrid. I'm sorry for stating my opinion.


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CommieBastard
post Jun 17 2004, 02:16 PM
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QUOTE (leopold @ Jun 17 2004, 01:18 PM)
QUOTE (CommieBastard @ Jun 16 2004, 05:06 PM)
I don't know that they're my team. I mean, they're from the same country my mother decided to move to and in which I live because I'm not yet old or independent enough to decide for myself where I want to live. And sure, there are plenty of lovely things about this country, but there are just as many about, say, France, Germany or America.

But you were born in this country, the one your own mother decided to move to before she gave birth to you. Doesn't that mean anything to you?

You misunderstand me. I'm not claiming a lack of Englishness because my mother wasn't born here (she was born in Wales anyway, it's not a huge difference). If both my parents' ancestors had come here with the Celts, I'd still feel the same.

Does being born here mean anything to me? No, not really. Imagine if my parents flew to Norway, my mother gave birth to me, and we flew back to England. Would I be one iota different? No; I would be precisely the same person I am now.

What do you mean when you say 'country', to which I should show allegiance and loyalty? The people, the government, the flag, the language, the land, the food, the weather? What is it I'm supposed to be supporting?


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Pixelgoth
post Jun 18 2004, 09:35 AM
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Sorry Leo but you probably won't appreciate this smile.gif Seriously no offense is intended to anyone.

My friend sent it to me this morning and I just remembered this thread and thought it was hilarious laugh.gif

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Government Announcement

New Motoring Law 2004

In order to assist other motorists in identifying potentially dangerous drivers, it's now compulsory for anyone with a lower than average driving ability to display a warning flag (comprising of a red cross on a white background) attached to the top of at least one door of their vehicle. For drivers of exceptionally low ability, additional flags are required.

Thank you for your attention.

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It had me in fits of laughter laugh.gif


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mooooooooooopo
post Jun 18 2004, 05:41 PM
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Those of yet lower ability are required to paint the entire car white with a red cross overlayed.


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post Jun 18 2004, 07:05 PM
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Now, I am a footie lover - and an admirer of the rather wonderful David James! rolleyes.gif

But I HATE it when England play because, living in Scotland, I get no end of abuse and nasty comments which really ticks me off!!

I'm proud to be English and I'm proud of our teams, whatever the sport as I think that we're often pretty good. But I hate the pettiness that seems to go hand-in-hand with it all. For example: when I worked in Aberdeen one of the secretaries, whom I was pretty friendly with said to me, "No offense ( which tells you immediately that you're about to be offended!!), but I support Scotland and anyone who's playing England". Neddless to say I was bloody offended!! dry.gif

Plus, on the subject of flags, just as we were leaving for work this morning I realised that my partner has a saltire (Scottish flag) on the back of his bike! Townie-tastic!!! mad.gif

Here endeth todays rant!!


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Cath Sparrow
post Jun 19 2004, 04:04 PM
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Weej I was sent this and thought you might just like it! biggrin.gif

New DVLA Ruling

With immediate effect : -

In order to assist other motorists in identifying potentially dangerous drivers, it is now compulsory for anyone with a lower than average driving
ability to display a warning flag (comprising of a red cross on a white
background) attached to top of at least one door of their vehicle.
For exceptionally low ability, additional flags are required.


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CommieBastard
post Jun 19 2004, 04:18 PM
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Pixie posted that already, Cath wink.gif


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Cath Sparrow
post Jun 19 2004, 04:28 PM
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Well as you can tell I'm paying lots of attention! biggrin.gif

But I do have something to add those flags have caused a increase in petrol consumtion by 4.5million gallons!


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post Jun 20 2004, 11:28 AM
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My apathy towards all issues of patriotism is legendary, so I won't be putting anything interesting into this debate, other than one observation:

We sell badges at Music Zone. Shortly before Euro 2004, we got in four new designs, each a variation on the ol' St. George cross. We sold quite a few, along with a number of footie anthems CDs and that Christ awful 4-4-2 single (singing "come on England" to the tune of 'Come On Eileen'? Wow, that's going to be good... dry.gif).

Then came the France match. Suddenly, our sales of England merch plummeted - we even had to drop the price of our England-centric anthems CD. Sales were few, and things looked bleak...

Yesterday, everything picked up again. We shifted loads of badges, and tons of CDs. Why? We drubbed the Swiss.

If we're going to show national pride - and I'm not, for various tedious reasons - then why can't we be consistent? There's no point loving your country if it's going to be a fair-weather friendship.

And that's the end of my mithering. Apart from to say that, as a pedestrian, car flags terrify me, as things fluttering past at speed and face-height tend to.


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