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> Opinion... I'm New, cutting issues
cuttingallover
post Aug 28 2004, 07:37 PM
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okay, im new to the website... i was looking for people to talk to abut cutting, now i know its a much debated topic, but im really trying to look for better ways to deal with stress and im not sure what to do or where to turn to, i mean i have a phsych but he told me to come back witha list of things i can do besides cutting, but still cause pain but in a healthy way...
alls i need is some insight please??!
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Silver Star Ange...
post Aug 28 2004, 08:59 PM
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You could take your stress out creatively, like in painting or music.


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gothictheysay
post Aug 28 2004, 09:12 PM
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Unfortunately, your want for pain is a problem too. =\ It's probably preferable you find another way entirely to deal with the stress - like what Silver said - but you could always work out or lift heavy things like I did and have sore arms the next day... but hopefully you should be able to work something out that doesn't actually cause pain but releases stress.


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PsychWardMike
post Aug 29 2004, 12:18 AM
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*sigh*

Anyway, if you want to actually stop doing that kind of stuff, you simply need to live life. Realize that problems are pretty miniscule in comparison to everything and that life is pretty good all and all. Work out, make friends, do something, but just don't be a cancer on teenage (and all) society.

Life is what you make of it - make something worth lving.


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Righteous
post Aug 29 2004, 02:06 AM
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(sigh)

Go out there. Get a life. Get a hobby. Join a band. Smoke some pot. Go have an Eskimo pie. Work out. Get a job. Run a mile. Do something. It's all in your hands.


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Aria
post Aug 29 2004, 02:28 AM
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Exercise, but be sure you don't over do it. Exercise is possibly the only "good" pain I can think of. Take up something like jogging.

As for cutting, I used to do it. I sort of weaned myself off of the selfhurt by going from cutting to burning with candlewax, which hurts for a bit, but doesn't generally cause any serious injury, and then just plain stopped. Dunno if it would work for you, but it might be worth a try.


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Aria
post Aug 29 2004, 02:30 AM
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QUOTE (PsychWardMike @ Aug 29 2004, 12:18 AM)
*sigh*

Anyway, if you want to actually stop doing that kind of stuff, you simply need to live life.  Realize that problems are pretty miniscule in comparison to everything and that life is pretty good all and all.  Work out, make friends, do something, but just don't be a cancer on teenage (and all) society.

Life is what you make of it - make something worth lving.
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Eh... It's not that easy if the person has clinical depression, or is bipolar or some such. it's not that simple.

Sorry, I just hate it when people trivialize depression. It is damn hard to live with. And it is NOT something you can snap out of.


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gothictheysay
post Aug 29 2004, 04:01 AM
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Very true, Aria.

This a problem that's probably something you should talk about with your psychiatrist/psychologist or whoever you are seeing. I wouldn't take too much outside advice. Although, I would be careful with what other behaviors you pick up once you stop. If your self-injury is addictive, it's easy to turn to other addicting habits - harmful or not. Smoking pot is probably not a very good idea at all. But your psych is a trained professional, so they should be able to help the most.


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EvilSpork
post Aug 29 2004, 04:12 AM
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...

Sam used to cut all the time... Sometimes up to 30 cuts at one time in all places on her body, and she told me she wished she could do more....

I don't really know what made her stop...

Urg bad memories.. Bad memories.....................
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Jaq
post Aug 29 2004, 07:09 AM
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I hate it when people trivialize this sort of thing by sighing or telling someone to snap out of it.
I've seen some good self injury websites who have suggestions on how to substitute self injury without hurting yourself badly. It really depends what you get the "pleasure" out of. If you like to see the blood then you can take a red marker and mark yourself where you usually cut yourself. If you burn yourself take an ice cube and hold it in your hand or where you usually burn yourself. If you hurt yourself for the pain you can put an elastic band around your wrist and snap it when you get stressed out. Another good one is to put a drop of hot sauce on your tongue.
I know that other people are telling you to exercise or paint instead of these things but you might not be at that stage in your recovery. You're probably just starting therapy and your psychiatrist/psychologist wants to keep you safe. He or she knows that you're still going to hurt yourself right now because that's your coping method and that you don't know any other way of coping right now. So by asking you to learn ways of giving yourself pain without hurting yourself s/he can keep you out of the psych ward (if they think a patient is a danger to themselves or others they will put you in the hospital) which I'm sure you definitely don't want. Once you learn other healthier coping methods (which takes some time) you can give these tricks up too.

Good luck. I hope that helped.


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PsychWardMike
post Aug 29 2004, 06:34 PM
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To Aria:

No where in this person's post did they say that they are clinically depressed. I know a lot of angsty teenagers that cut themselves and cry listending to Nirvana by candlelight. That's not clinical depression; that's angst for the sake of angst which can very easily be overcome. The advice that I gave is exactly what I did to get out of my own angst stages.

I do not trivialize clinical depression; I know plain and well that it's a disease (enough people in my family have it...) and that it needs to be dealt with. However, I have my doubts about a teenager named "cuttingallover" coming to a message board and, as their first post, talking about how they cut themselves. It doesn't seem the mark of most depressed people that I've met, but everyone's different.

However, I would be tempted to, if I didn't know better, say that this was almost an attempt at "attention whoring." That, of course, would be if I didn't know better, though.

As for this cutting person? I'm awaiting a response to any of our replies.


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Aria
post Aug 29 2004, 06:44 PM
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QUOTE (PsychWardMike @ Aug 29 2004, 06:34 PM)
To Aria:

No where in this person's post did they say that they are clinically depressed.  I know a lot of angsty teenagers that cut themselves and cry listending to Nirvana by candlelight.  That's not clinical depression; that's angst for the sake of angst which can very easily be overcome.  The advice that I gave is exactly what I did to get out of my own angst stages.

I do not trivialize clinical depression; I know plain and well that it's a disease (enough people in my family have it...) and that it needs to be dealt with.  However, I have my doubts about a teenager named "cuttingallover" coming to a message board and, as their first post, talking about how they cut themselves.  It doesn't seem the mark of most depressed people that I've met, but everyone's different.

However, I would be tempted to, if I didn't know better, say that this was almost an attempt at "attention whoring."  That, of course, would be if I didn't know better, though.

As for this cutting person?  I'm awaiting a response to any of our replies.
*


Neh. I would personally avoid trivializing depression or even 'angst'. You simply don't know this person's situation. Neither do I, but as such, I think it's better if you avoid treating as something you should snap out of. This person IS seeing a shrink, which generally indicates that there's something medically/physiologically wrong with him or her.

In any case, even if it were teenage angst, I still find it's better to treat their problems with the same seriousness as you would if it weren't. Sometimes, you just need people to listen, and care, rather than toss off advices, and sighs. Being tempted to write them off as attention whores, and saying so in the thread that they post is sort of wretched too, no offense. Sometimes, you do need to take things seriously, suspend disbelief, whatever-- because you *don't* know the person's situation. If you were their best friend, and saw this, and knew it wasn't true, sure... call them on it. Until you know, you should take people seriously.

And I'm not really sure this thread requires a response on this person's part. They asked for suggestions, they got them, it's all good.

Edit: if anyone, be it angsty teenager, or clinically depressed 50 year is old is cutting themselves, they need SOME form of help. Period. Being an angsty teenager shouldn't mean you can write off people cutting themselves.


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PsychWardMike
post Aug 29 2004, 07:20 PM
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So I suppose we're polar opposites.

Note: this has become an argument, not over this person in particular.

Angsty teenagers that cut themselves are seeking attention. They tell people they cut for some sort of shock value and the immediate attention they recieve thereafter. I have found that, of all the teenagers that cut themselves that I've met, about 1 in 15 actually had something wrong with them. The rest went along with it, after convincing themselves that they belong to a certain clique (goth/emo, most often) and proceed to do so for acceptance. It's not, for most cases that I've seen, a form or release, but a form of getting people to like them. That's not depression - it's just a case of an a teenager doing anything they can to get people to like them.


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Aria
post Aug 29 2004, 07:46 PM
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QUOTE (PsychWardMike @ Aug 29 2004, 07:20 PM)
So I suppose we're polar opposites.

Note:  this has become an argument, not over this person in particular.

Angsty teenagers that cut themselves are seeking attention.  They tell people they cut for some sort of shock value and the immediate attention they recieve thereafter.  I have found that, of all the teenagers that cut themselves that I've met, about 1 in 15 actually had something wrong with them.  The rest went along with it, after convincing themselves that they belong to a certain clique (goth/emo, most often) and proceed to do so for acceptance.  It's not, for most cases that I've seen, a form or release, but a form of getting people to like them.  That's not depression - it's just a case of an a teenager doing anything they can to get people to like them.
*



If they're cutting themselves for attention, they still need help. If they're cutting themselves to fit in, they need help. Period. Cutting yourself for any reason is unhealthy, and they either need help in being more assertive, and more comfortable with themselves, or they need help seeking attention in positive ways. They need help. Period. Cutting is NOT healthy.


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PsychWardMike
post Aug 29 2004, 08:20 PM
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No, they do not need help. They need maturity and an epiphany. That's all.


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Mutilation
post Aug 29 2004, 09:11 PM
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Listen to Radiohead, roll around on the floor and hit your head against a wooden plank. Seriously it helps.
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Righteous
post Aug 29 2004, 10:17 PM
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I'm not trivializing it; look at the scars on my arm. All I'm saying is that finding something to channel your energies keeps you from carving yourself up.

I will advise this: Don't substitute one bad habit for another. Don't drink massive amounts of alcohol and say it keeps you from cutting.

I never got help. I did get a major epiphany when Spiffy saw the scars on my arm and cried, though...


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spiffilicious05
post Aug 30 2004, 12:17 AM
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I've been through cutting and other methods of self inflicted pain myself. I know that it's hard to give up and it seems so insignificant when it comes to you doing it yourself rather than when one of your friends is doing. All I can tell you is to talk to some friends, have them help you with your problems. Go out with them, watch movies -- do something. Guy/girl hunting is always fun.

I know that helped me, along with my music. I learned how to play the guitar.


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Phyllis
post Aug 30 2004, 02:16 AM
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You know what is far more annoying than angsty teenage whining, Mike?

Other people constantly making a big deal about said angsty teenage whining. wink.gif You sure do whine quite a lot about other peoples' whining. Doesn't that seem a bit useless to you? It seems to be your own outlet for angst -- complaining about its existence in others. Heh. tongue.gif

Meanwhile, back on the actual topic, other people have given some good suggestions...and they are far more qualified to give advice on the subject, as I have never had to deal with self-injury issues myself.


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PsychWardMike
post Aug 30 2004, 02:25 AM
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dotdotdot.

I love the way you overlook the actual advice that I gave, but focus on the attitude. I don't like angst because I went through it myself and now see that it was a collossal waste of time; I get annoyed at people that come to message boards and cry about how they cut themselves. So yeah, I get annoyed, and yes I don't like teenage angst, but don't say that I didn't give some advice.

So yeah, don't like that I don't like angst? Tough. That's who I am. Just as I'm sure you're going to assert that it's the way you are and that cutting is is the way the other person is.

But whatever. My words will affect you as much as they'll affect cuttingallover - however much you let it. So how useless is it?


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Dreams On Hiatus
post Aug 30 2004, 02:58 AM
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I don't know what to say, because most of the advice given I would have given as well. Also - dunno if this would work for you but I'm trying to give you some advice (and I hope that the advice everyone gave you helps smile.gif) - take a notebook or something with blank pages in it and fill it with rants or instead of actually inflicting pain on yourself, write about inflicting pain on yourself. Only problem is if someone finds the book and then you might run into trouble there, so I don't know what to say. sad.gif Good luck.


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Righteous
post Aug 30 2004, 04:55 AM
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There's a big difference between angst and a serious problem. I've seen both. Cutting out of angst does require maturity and a little compassion. Then again, there are times where it takes a lot more than a great realization; they require help. There must be that moment where you decide that this kind of self-destruction isn't neccessary. You can't make someone get there; it has to happen and bickering like a pair of school children won't do a damn bit of good.


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Snugglebum the D...
post Aug 30 2004, 12:07 PM
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QUOTE
I love the way you overlook the actual advice that I gave, but focus on the attitude. I don't like angst because I went through it myself and now see that it was a collossal waste of time;


It's easy to trivialise teenage angst when you've done it yourself, grown out of it and have the advantage of hindsight. I do exactly the same thing. However, if you try and remember what it was like at the time, how everything turned into a drama - how would you have liked people to have dealt with you?

I know for a fact that 'Pull yourself together' really would have been one of the worst things to say.

That and 'You'll grow out of it' (mainly because that one's true wink.gif )


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Ashbless
post Aug 30 2004, 01:16 PM
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I was just wondering if there is something that triggers the desire to reach for the sharp object?
When he/she is wanting to cut what thoughts are running through their head? I'm talking seriously and in no way sarcastic here. Maybe the person could take a pen and jot down everything they are thinking at that moment. It could help when they see how unreasonable some of the thoughts are.
I haven't had a cutting problem but some less than admirable behaviour on my part can be triggered off by the little self critical voice. The one that mutters that you'll never be well loved, never be smart enough. The one you have to realize is there and then to realize it's full of sh*t. Actively dragging those thoughts out onto a piece of paper is a good way to see how unreasonable and hurtful and outright wrong they are. They're like vampires and do die in the sunlight.


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Jaq
post Aug 30 2004, 02:13 PM
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Took this grammar!
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QUOTE (Snugglebum the Destroyer @ Aug 30 2004, 09:07 PM)
QUOTE
I love the way you overlook the actual advice that I gave, but focus on the attitude. I don't like angst because I went through it myself and now see that it was a collossal waste of time;


It's easy to trivialise teenage angst when you've done it yourself, grown out of it and have the advantage of hindsight. I do exactly the same thing. However, if you try and remember what it was like at the time, how everything turned into a drama - how would you have liked people to have dealt with you?

I know for a fact that 'Pull yourself together' really would have been one of the worst things to say.

That and 'You'll grow out of it' (mainly because that one's true wink.gif )
*



Exactly. You think you can say it's _just_ teenage angst because you're not a teenager anymore or you've gotten over your teenage angst but you really don't know why this person cuts. It might be to fit in with a certain group. If it is then it still isn't healthy. Hurting yourself for the acceptance of others is still cause for concern. If it is "classic" self injury behavior where this person is hurting themselves as a form of coping with the stresses that they can't vocalize to their family or friends then maybe they can only talk about it with a group of faceless voiceless strangers on the internet and their psychiatrist.
Before you judge someone and their situation at least try to get a little bit of information about their situation.


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