May I first say that I'm not trying to be hatefull or offend anyone with this topic and I'd like to think that while I've been here I haven't intentionally stirred anyone or acted like a horrible person cos I'm not I'm just over curious.

OK Topic

Fat people

What do you generally think when you see obese people in the street.
Do you feel pity, revulsion, lucky, healthy, superior, disgusted, curiosity over how they got that way or if it's a medical problem, anger over the fact that obese people seem to have eating habits of a kind that they frequently have fat children and thats irrisponsible and a terrible thing to inflict on a child, concern over their health and mental state and for their families, repulsed by their appearence?
Do you ever see obese people and think "I'm never going near unhealthy food XXX ever again" or "I'm going to run somewhere every day for the rest of my life"?

I personally have felt all of these at one time or another
I was motivated by some of them to loose the wieght I did years ago, I hated the thought of getting so fat that I'd have to hold my hands in front of me on top of my stomach and that I could end up in a tent dress by the time I was 25 it sickened me to think that at the rate I was gaining weight I could be 150 kilos at 23.

Now I can't hep but be shocked at a certain woman at my local supermarket who goes in on shelf packing day and buys whole boxes of bagged crisps, dorritos and 6 kinds of fizzy drinks before they're even unpacked to look in her shopping trolly she has no vegtables or tins, no meals that even need to be prepared just snack food and instant heat and serve meals, I don't understand her motivation, is she so hopeless that she would rather just eat the food she likes that she knows is unhealthy, does she not care about herself so much that she's willing to eat crap, does she not realise that she could be healthier and save money by just going around the corner to big al's and filling a trolly with vegies and fruit and they would take no more effort to eat and she could relax and know that she was doing herself good just by not not doing somthing?



I really don't know how the wrap this up exept to say yet again that I don't want to offend anyone and I am genuinelly interested in your opinions.

It's an interesting point, in a documentry not long ago where this docter who told this anicdote about this fat woman who started berating this person for lighting a cigarette, but no one turned around to her and told her weighing as much as she does can be just as dangerous as smoking (that's what I was led to believe at least). Basically it boiled down to, why is it socially acceptable to tell people off for smoking, make them feel bad about it and so on, when mentioning that someone has a weight problem, even if it's out of concern for someone's health, is such a social faux-pas?

When I see a fat person I feel scared that one day I shall become like so. I wonder how they became to be fat too.

I also feel sorry for them because I was watching a documentary about a fat 18year old. He still kept up his bad eating habits because he was living in the hope that he would be accepted to have surgery where they make the tummy smaller. He never was accepted I don't think. He was in the swimming pool one time and was crying because he knew that people were staring at him.

Another lady on the program had recieved a present from a secret friend on the internet and was also crying because it meant so much to her because she knew that someone out there was supporting her as she tried to loose weight.

I feel some admiration too when a large person can overcome this and not feel embarassed and perhaps wear a skirt or something.

Lastly, I feel lucky that I'm not like so. I'm not necessarily happy about my own weight and as selfish as it is, I'm not going to lie, it makes me feel better when I see someone who is worse off.

Fat bloke here - well, a couple of BMI points into "overweight". And I really can't bring myself to care. My body already does everything I could reasonably ask of it, and I have much more important things to worry about.

Anyway, overweight people live longer.

Eep. I'm only 95 pounds. ::keels over, dies::

Sorry, I'm going to be utterly un-PC here.
I find that obese (not fat, obese) people revolt me.
The sight of someone with that much blubber waddling along makes me feel physically sick.

How can you abuse your body like that, and no whining 'its glandular' you did it to yourself, you made yourself fat cause you ate too much and you didn't do enough exercise.
If you have a medical problem that gives you weight issues you have to be strong willed enough to not eat those pies, to take that medication and to follow that exercise plan.

I find the most distressing thing of all is obese children, the parent can control the childs diet, educate and encourage them to eat well and to be active, but obviously neglected to do so. That is well out of order. Is so easy. Don't feed them fatty junk, and don't let them watch tv 24-7. Its not rocket science, everyone is bombarded with infomation now about how to live a healthy life, ignorance is no longer an excuse.

Now, I'm not a fat person, far from it. Currently I run a BMI (18.5) on the border of ideal and underweight so I am the slim person you all hate. However its not hard, just think before you eat.

And I'm just as intolerent on smoking - the UK ban can't come soon enough.

I think one of the main rebuttals of the smoking vs. obesity debate is that a person who eats more than is considered healthy does not generally force food into the mouths of others while doing it, where a smoker does put their smoke in the lungs of their friends (not to mention making their hair and clothes smell awful).

I'm a reasonable weight for my height, but I still am generally very careful about what I eat and try to exercise when I find the time. It's about finding the right balance for you, I think.

I don't really have issues with people's weight per se, but I do feel a little annoyed when I see parents teaching their children the same habits. I understand how difficult it is to control weight from trying to stay in control of my own shape as my body gets older to seeing friends with similar difficulties, but it still annoys me when people are clearly not looking after their children's wellfare.

I guess this is just my usual beliefs coming out again though: it's one thing to choose to something, or live one way, yourself but it is quite different to force that lifestyle onto another, especially children who have no real way of knowing any better or choosing another option. None of the food issues made me as sick as pregnant women coming into my off-license (a liquor store) where I used to work and asking for twenty cigarettes.

Sometimes it makes me sad. For example, I'd like people I love to eat better just as I'd like them not to smoke or drive up the road the wrong way. It does irk me a little when morbidly obese people go around running over my toes in the Shop Rite in their motorized chairs. It really makes me angry when I see this boy in my church who's fat to the point of it being a danger to his health, and it's not entirely because of bad metabolism; it's because his equally fat mother feeds him on loads and loads of crap. That really ought to be considered child abuse. But I'm in trouble right now for being underweight, which is equally as bad, so I generally withhold judgement on overweight people.

I believe that some it may be deppresion. What I mean is: If you are freinds with someone who is extreamly skinny and shoves it in your face all the time, You just want to go and have a snack. I know this, being at the point of a bit overweight for my height. When you have a freind who shoves it in your face that they are skinner then you and that they keep needing smaller sizes, it doesnt exactly help you feel better about yourself. Rather then wanting to go out and excersice after that, you want to stay in and finish off a bag of chips. This may be part of it.

I'm all for calling it child abuse to allow your child to become morbidly obese.
I know several families in my town have done it and it's really sad to see a kid who was a bit fat at 7 grow to be alot fat at 8, obese at 10, and end up a round ball by the time they hit puberty.
In America there was a woman who had her 7 year old son taken away because he weighed 180lbs and then had her baby taken away because when she went to see her son who had been returned to a normal weight she gave him a mars bar.

If anything it's dangerous that it's so unheard of to critcise peoples weight when they're at that 3 points over the BMI stage thinking about it thats the best time to do it before it becomes a problem. I'm not going to go hunting down everyone who doesn't want to get up and get activated but it rally rubs me the wrong way to hear "I'm happy to be me" and " big is beautiful" "you go girl" etc they're just cop outs from overwhelmed people.

I'm a big ol' boy. Rather overweight, however as pgrmdave, trunksgirl, and artistunkown can attest, I am only mildly out of shape. I can run long distances if a situation necessitates, I can lift very large amounts of weight. I think that I carry myself rather nicely (I might be wrong there, though ) Anyway, I'm rolly polly but I'm happy. I dance, I work out, and life's okay. Of course losing some weight is a goal for me. I fully intend on joining a gym when I have sufficient funds, but I know that I am physically strong enough to deal with whatever life throws at me and there's more of me to love.

That said, I have to be on a sitcom. I am a very large man and I have an inproportionately beautiful girlfriend.

I rule. \m/ (>_<) \m/

Anyway, on the subject of other people, I'm in no position to judge, but I find myself doing it anyway. There are some morbidly obese people today and I'm a little grossed out. Hypocritical, I know, but I can't exactly help it. However, I want to take this time to point out that incredibly skinny people are gross, too. I don't want someone who I'm afraid to break if I hold them close. I don't want an AAA cup bra size. I want someone I can hold on to and that means someone normal - not an extreme of any size spectrum.

Man, I could quote so many of your posts and have so much more to say, but I'll start with this:



I'll start by posting a quote from a friend of mine who, at one point, weighed 597lbs.

"I'm convinced that natural weight loss is the simplest thing in the world, just horribly not easy. It's the same as telling an alcoholic to just not drink anymore, simple but hard. They can at least live without alcohol, we have to dance with our demon everyday for the rest of our lives, and sometimes we get our toes stepped on."

I, myself, weigh far more than I should and I still endure a lot of abuse from people. I am far from lazy, though I do have my lazy moments. It's not as easy as "well, you're fat - exercise, eat better, and do something with your life!" It's not as easy as always remembering to take medication, and I won't even get into the nightmares that can come from gastric bypass - that's another rant for another time.

I can say from experience that most fat people don't want your pity. They want to go through a day without someone assuming something about them, looking down on them, insulting them, and most of all, they want to go through a day where they are treated just like everyone else is treated. Much the way some of you find us obese people disgusting, we find particular attitudes and actions disgusting too.

Big can be beautiful. Fat people are allowed to have confidence too. They're allowed to have positive self images, and they're allowed to believe they have characteristics and qualities that somebody, somewhere, will see beauty in them. Why would anyone want to take that away from someone else?

Maybe I'm weird in thinking that my weight is absolutely nobody else's business. You don't pay for my health insurance premiums, I don't force what I eat on you, and I certainly don't invade your life in any way. I'd even go so far as to say that I really don't give a damn what other people think about me, because you know what? If they can't take the time to see past what I weigh, they certainly aren't worth the effort of getting to know them. I don't walk by others and judge them based on their appearances because interestingly enough, I was taught better than that.

Is obesity a problem? Definitely. But obesity isn't going to go away overnight. And it's definitely not going to go away when there are so many attitudes that make overweight people shy away rather than try to get the help that they need. Education, tolerance, and understanding go a lot further than snarky comments.

I quite agree there. I'm rather over weight for my hight and yet when my boy and I went with his family hiking to go swimming at a water fall, I was the first one there and back. I was practicly running up the steps and I even have exersize induced asthma. I eat healthy, except for an occasional (once a month) indulge in to junk food OR fast food. I drink water, rarely any soda at all because I hate High Fruictose so most of the time I also drink 100% juice when I have a sweet tooth, I love veggies and fruits and so on. So, why am I over weight? Because I don't have the funds to tone up what muscles I have nor do I know how to do it on my own.

Anyways. As mike said... I rule! So, next time you see that fat or over wieght person at your super market, stalking up on those junk foods. Just remember, she just might be having a party to celibrate something or other.

On a side note, my mother and I were standing waiting for a bus to take us home one time. We were eating grapes (YUM!) and this woman walked by and muttered to where we could hear it, "Well, it's good to see some of you people eating something good once in a while."

Sometimes, you just can't win.

I doubt she's doing that several weeks in a row I go shopping on saturdays becayse they discount the meat on that day every week without fail she's there wuth that kind of thing in her trolly

Perhaps not in your country, but certainly in mine.

Which does raise the question of whether countries that have a socialised healthcare system, run (ostensibly) by the government, and funded by a universally applied income tax, ought to treat illnesses that are 100% unavoidable?

I'm not claiming that 100% of obese people could have avoided it by eating less pies, and going for a jog occasionally, but (certainly in Britian), I suspect that the vast majority of obesity is self-inflicted through a crappy diet and no exercise. It does beg the question - why should I be forced to pay for your gastric bypass? Likewise, why should I foot the bill for NHS treatment of smoking-related illnesses? Or can we lay the blame at the government's door for not eduacting the masses sufficiently on how to live a healthy life...

That's not how I feel, but it's a valid question.

Hi. I'm Ri and I'm 5'6", 210.

Now, considering how many on the maternal side of my family are obese, I'm, in a sense, used to it. I don't feel pity, revulsion, lucky, healthy, superior, disgusted or curiosity really, however I sometimes spout out the multipurpose "Damn" every once-in-a-while. Also, I once saw a thing on the news about obese babies and I was horrified. I mean, how could you feed a child to the point where your toddler is barely mobile?

Occasionally, my friends and I will discuss obesity. We do get annoyed when we see obese people at the supermarket or jiff buying an assload of junk food or destroy the buffet before we get a chance to destroy it. My brother once went on about a plan he had to overcome obesity in America. This included making fat people park farther away from buildings, making us stand during meals at restaurants and restricting us certain amounts and types of food at buffets, supermarkets and jiffs.

Yes, there are certain people who blame it on themselves, but also there are those who really can't help it. Cases in point: My buddie Big Adam's parents are, well, big. His dad's almost breaking 300 and his mother is confined to a wheelchair. He's screwed. He barely eats, but he's still a big cat (though a lot of it's muscle; this guy's strong). The same goes for my brother's bassist Jon, though his family's not as overweight at Big Adam's (strangely, though, his brother is very tall and very skinny; we seriously wonder how that happened. My friends Alan, Harmonie and Big Matt live active, healthy lifestyles (Big Matt's a hardcore skater and Alan and Harmonie have labor-intensive jobs) but they have weight issues. Spiffy and I both have underactive thyroids and resulting weight issues (though she's taller and has a larger skeletal frame than I, so she has more of an excuse).

I feel self-consious sonetimes about it. WHen we go to the beach or swimming or something where I have to take my shirt off, I sometimes get weird about it. Ususally, my first thought is, "I'll never pick up chicks looking like this." I used to feel like people were staring at my gut, but now I tell myself that they're staring at the tattoo on my chest. Sometimes it works; sometimes it doesn't. Overall, though, I'm not ashamed of my appearence. I won't wear a shirt outside if it's damn hot and I can get away with it. I'll talk to chicks at the beach even if I'm aware of the fact that I have a large gut. The only time I get astoundily self-conscious about it is before I get laid. It's the whole exposure thing. I could have been with the chick for a long time and I'd still have the desire to put my clothes back on and run. I can hide it well, though. I'm not lying; I'm acting.

Yes, big can be beautiful (within reason at least). Chicks who are particularly skinny don't really turn me on (guys on the other hand...). I like girls who are cuddly and soft and won't be crushed if I'm on top. I mean, even I have my limits, but I'm not like my brother and his friends, who all have petite, thin, blonde or red-headed teen movie-looking girlfriends (I'm more into the this-is-how-women-in-the-real-world-look look).

Also, having been made fun of throughout the years because of my fatness, I'd rather people not give me crap about it, save my friends but they're allowed to. It's my weight, my body, my business so shut up. I've gotten laid, so I can't be doing too bad.

I gained a buttload of weight in the second grade because of depression. I had a lot of issues with depression since and during said issues is when I ate the most. I was, for lack of a better term, a fat f*ck.

All in all, I recognize obesity to be a problem, but it's not really my problem. I mean, I'll offer help and support, but I once had a teacher who loved to point out how the guy behind me and I were overweight in a sick, sad attempt to condition all of us to be health nuts like her. We found out later, however, that she was fat as Hell growing up and apparently had repressed hatred for fat people.

In conclusion: Give me someone to cuddle.

My mother is a secretary for a real estate agent, and her nephew is three years old and literally as wide as he is tall.

I think there's some popular oversimplification about obesity. A person thats.. say 20 to what, 50 pounds every weight is a very different thing. They might have a busy job, have just had a baby or just be a bit out of shape. Lazy too, depending. Generally they function normally enough and while there's still health risks, decent functioning is possible. A gym and a diet could likely fix it at this point.

I find it very hard to believe that obesity at higher levels where it affects health, functioning and your life drastically doesn't have a massive emotional component. Self-hatred being the first thing that comes to mind. Taking care of yourself tends to go hand in hand with self-esteem. Food can also be a real comfort thing, especially in some families or women. Thinking of the cliche of eating a big bowl of ice cream should your man break up with you, ect.

To fix something grounded in emotional and/or family issues isn't as simple as diet and exercise. The person has to heal and find the strength to -fight-. They might also have to see themselves and their futures as mattering enough to fight for. People abuse a lot of 'drugs' and food's certainly the easiest to get should you want to drown your sorrows.

I don't think we should promote something thats that unhealthy (ie fat is beautiful), but an overweight person doesn't need more comments, glances ect. Its nothing they haven't 1) thought of or 2) aren't aware of. It would be more helpful to have someone that cared about them and their health beyond appearances that encouraged them to want something better.

Hmm. I'm overweight. I have disordered eating-- not an eating disorder. I see obese people, and I'm hit with a wave of self loathing, because I end up thinking that *I'll* be like that if I don't have better self control. This leads me to surviving on green tea, and fruit for as long as I can (generally about a week before I give up), and I'll do my best to exercise a lot.

I don't think that losing weight is as simple as everyone thinks-- I've gotten to the point where I'd be doing an hour a day of exercise, sometimes more, and I would not be losing weight-- and I'd be eating healthily!

So... Basically, obese people trigger selfloathing in me, I don't think obesity is as simple as people thing-- so I don't feel revulsion at obese people, I just feel scared that I might look like that someday.

i think im like 10 lb overweight. i was about 15 lb less 10 months ago, but at that point i was 5 lb less than i usually am. i feel bad though, because i know i gained 15 lb. thats a lot. but on the other hand i think, well i know i can atribute some of this to my F cup boobs, and the fact that school has me sitting in a class all day long, and heredity. but sometimes i feel so bad about it, and i just hate myself. i am kind of hoping over the summer ill loose 10 lb and be fine because i will be going out and doing fun stuff a lot more, but maybe i wont, and maybe i will still be how i am now in september. i dont know what to do because i am certainly not obsese, but i feel bad about myself, and i absolutely love chocolate and hate excersize. on the other hand, i know that the government changed the BMI's standards for healthy weight a few decades ago, and if it had been before that i would be consitered normal. BUT, now if i gain another 15 lb, i will be obese. i dont think that will happen, but im still scared. also, i have plenty of friends in school, but all the kids in my grade absolutely hate me. they sent around mean "freshman superlatives" and i was voted "most unaware of their obesity." for one, i was upset because i know for a fact that i am NOT obsese, and secondly, what did i do to them, people i have barely talked to all year, to make them say these things about me, and thirdly, why would they send that to me??


sorry for ranting, just my 2 cents

According to dolly magazine I'm 15 kilos (33 pounds) over weight, acording to doctors charts I'm 2-3 kilos ( 4.5-6.5 pounds) over weight and acording to the BMI I'm spot on healthy.
In conclusion will somone tell us what to go on

Well for a start BMI is scientifically based, where as Dolly Magazine is fashion based.

I'm guessing the BMI scale is essentially to show people what is healthy where as Dolly would be more interested in making people look like models on TV rather than real people.

Edit: Hehe, the Dolly Discussion boards is great entertainment.

My dietician uses BMI. So I'd trust that over any magazine.

It should be. If you eat the correct range of healthy calories (1700 for an active, gym giong person or so) and exercise with a proper intensity (not just for a long while), you should be losing weight regularly. Its not easy, but it should be happening. If you aren't, there's a good chance somethings wrong with the workout, your diet or something like your thyroid. Surviving on green tea and fruit would a week (though a lot of us have done similiar things *cough, south beach, cough) is not the path to losing weight for a length of time.

It took me a bit to get the hang of an actual healthy diet and longer to hash out what made an effective workout (as opposed to one that seemed hard-ish to me at first), but once I -did- get it figured out.. its been simple since. Though I had to do that consistency thing. >.>

Yeah, I heard somewhere that good old Bushy is overweight, despite being in better shape than 98% of men his age. I think the standards are a bit high.

Losing weight itself isn't hard, unless you do have a chemical or hormonal imbalance or other health issues that limit mobility. It's maintaining the loss that's harder than most people can even imagine. Unfortunately, I have several issues that contribute to weight gain and instability. The two major ones were *just* diagnosed this year, so I have about 23 years of undoing habits and mentalities, on top of a physical disability. I think this, more than anything, is why it irritates me to no end when people make comments about how fat someone is. Unless you know the person, you can't honestly make the judgement that the fat person walking across the street is just lazy, or he or she isn't eating right. It is most definitely a self esteem issue at some point - and rude looks or comments truly do more harm than good.

Last year, about this time, I was about 60lbs lighter. And then, in July, I was in a car accident that left me literally off my feet for almost 8 months. Hellooo weight, how I missed you - not! I had to learn to walk again, I still have to wear a brace on my ankle and I am in a lot of pain on a daily basis. But, when I actually set my mind to it, I started losing weight again in March, and have been able to keep it off. I've only lost about 20lbs, but even that amount made a huge difference in how I feel.

I suppose I'm rambling about this because it's not that I don't know that being overweight or obese isn't healthy - it's the reactions some of you have shown to people you don't even know.

Good luck, oxymoronical. I can't speak for the disability part, but as for the rest, I've been there. Its taken me 24 years to heal enough to actually stop a lot of my habits and start new ones. Oddly enough, its also the first time I'm really heading towards a weight I'll admit too. I don't really have anything brilliant to add just that I've been there and hear you.

i wish not everyone was SO obsessed with being tiny-my own friends will call girls thinner than me fat in front of my face! and ill say '...um excuse me but that girl isnt fat at all, thats just her build. if shes fat im like huge.' and they will say 'oh its because we dont like her' or something like that. but even though i am only about 10 lb overweight, their was chain mail sent around my school about me calling me obsese!

^I've known people who'll do that exact same thing^.
Do they honestly not think you're fat then or do they have different standards for people not their friends the way you have differnt standards for family ( like if your parents are really ugly you probably wouldn't see it as much as if they were strangers)?
bizare things like a girl I knew critising her weight, complementing me on how I looked in a pair of skin tight trousers and trying the trousers on herself seeing that they were huge (wouldn't stay up) and giving them back then going back to going on about how huge she was.

Just because not many people measure up to the standards, doesn't mean they're too high, maybe people are just low scorers? Does that mean, through democracy, people who meet up to these "high" standards are in fact under weight?

Oh, I know that surviving on green tea and fruit isn't healthy, hence me referring to it as disordered eating...

As for the exercise, I just bike to and from university, which is roughly half an hour each way. I figure my lack of weight loss is a) due to muscle gain or due to my damn weakness for chocolate.

My diet could be better. I know this. I just have a hard time figuring out what *is* a good diet.

That's fine, I find that people with attitudes like yours are just as disgusting to me.

Hmm...we've done this topic to death already, I think. Several times. But I guess I'll restate my opinion anyway. It's really not that simple. A lot of obese adults were also obese children. Trying to unlearn habits that have been a part of your life for that long is far from simple. Sort of like learning a new language and forgetting your old one, if it's from a time when you were very young until your mid 20s, 30s, 40s, whenever.

Ditto, I know I could eat stuff that is much better for me but it's hard to find the right balance of stuff I like and is healthy and just stuff I like because I'm a really fussy eater. I'm also a compulsive eater, I can get through a box of cereal bars in a few hours if I'm bored enough.

My BMI is apparently 23-point-something which is apparently in hte normal range so I guess that's good.

I have a habit of eating large portions, helping other people finish their portions and compulsively eating snack food yet I have a BMI that's about half a unit above being underweight.

Eating habits are not the only thing involved, it's a lot less simple than that so generalisations like those made in many above posts (mainly beleraphon's claims of being revolted by obese people because they "abuse their bodies") simply do not make sense when there are many other factors involved. Thyroid problems, differing metabolic rates and habits drilled in as a child all have an effect, as do many other factors I've probably missed. Screaming "eat less pie" at someone is not going to make a difference if their eating habits are not the problem. At worst it could cause the person to feel bad about themselves and make the problem worse, for instance through comfort eating.

Sure there may be some proportion of obese people where it is caused by bad eating habits and lack of self control but tarring everybody with the same brush won't solve anything.

Mm, see, my BMI is somewhere around 17.8. Like moop, I have mutant metabolism, but unlike moop, I'm lazy about remembering/finishing meals. I'm not going to judge large people because my eating habits are equally deplorable; it just means dying of liver failure rather than a heart attack. (It does irritate me somewhat that I'm threatened with a clinic, but overweight people aren't. If you're underweight, it's a disease; if you're overweight, you just need to reform your naughty Dorito ways, see you next checkup.) So I'm off to the good ol' nutritionist's today. I don't want to go. But weight has medical, not just aesthetic, implications. A nutritionist should help find alternatives to both the Dorito Diet and amateur fruit diets. And if it's emotional reasons, that should be looked after too. There's no point in sloppy suicide.

EDIT: Also, a point of irony. We rail on about what schools can do to stop childhood obesity, but the other day school provided lunch for my brother's class and it was Coke, potato chips (crisps), and hot dogs. I think there's a whole lot of talk and not much action going on to stop this problem where is starts, because, like someone said earlier, obese people were often not taught good eating habits as children. Ugh.

First off - public area smoking ban needed in the UK... damn RIGHT! should also be coupled with a massive tax increase in ciggies.

Back on Topic:

Beleraphon, - I'm only quoting you and not the others as I feel you've best summed up a point that others have made that I disagree with... so please everyone note that I'm arguing against the issue - and not just trying to have a go at Bel.

Fair enough you gave us warning that you were going to be utterly un-PC, but that's no excuse for what I see as an ignorant post. I'm not going to condemn you feeling of revulsion at seeing "...someone with that much blubber waddling along...", or for you dislike of people who give in to temptation and do eat too much of the wrong kind of food.

However, there are many people who do suffer from various medical conditions that cannot be overcome by will power, healthy eating and exercise. There is a significant minority of people who are obese (and I note that you differentiate between being obese and simply fat), but who have little or no control over this.

One of my best friends has a specific hormonal problem which means she is overweight to the point of being obese, she eats very sensibly and exercises as much as she can... but it doesn't make any difference. The medical condition is still there and will still affect her, (though if she ate junk food and didn't exercise she would be even worse). It is a medical problem (like so many others) that the professionals don't really understand, and as such can only keep at bay, rather than effectively cure.

So when you say:

it's pretty clear to me that you're just not aware of how difficult or complicated this kind of problem can be. It isn't always about eating disorders, there are a host of other factors which cannot be ignored, nor can they be oversimplified down to "you should be more strong willed".

I fully accept that there are people who are abusing themselves (and as an aside I completely agree with your point of parents who poison their kids with so much junk food that they are forcing them into obesity), just as there are people who try to overcome their problems but lapse, or don't manage to go far enough. But I urge you not to tar everyone with the same brush. There are some people who do eat very well, and exercise but don't lose weight, or don't lose as much weight, and gain it very easily (by failing to excessive every other half hour as much or by eating a water biscuit more than your recommended starvation diet).

Now from what you've posted on this thread and elsewhere I'm guessing that you are more concerned with the obese people who aren't trying to help themselves, and I hope you'd be less critical of those cases where people really can't help being obese, but try to limit the damage it does to them. I'm not saying that you shouldn't feel the revulsion you mentioned earlier, I just hope that everyone who has posted here realises that not everyone can help themselves, and that even to those who do - losing weight can be extremely difficult.


It is a valid question, and perhaps the answer is maybe doctors should be free to refuse certain treatment to patients who refuse to do what's in their best interests. People who are admitted to hospital for smoking related illness (not passive smoking related) - should be treated on the NHS, but that should be stopped if they continue to smoke during or after treatment.

Within the last few years there have been reported cases where doctors have withheld treatment because patients continued to smoke even after (for example) bypass surgery due to smoke related problems or treatment for lung cancer, or even organ transplants.

As to obesity, I think that we can't deny people NHS treatment until we get our school dinners in order. We can't say on one hand 'you shouldn't rely on the state to help out your eating problem' and on the other hand say 'here kids eat this junk fast food at school'. We also need to stop schools from selling off p0laying fields. We need to tax fast, junk and convenience food more highly, and above all else we need to lower the price of healthy food and give tax breaks to gyms and sports grounds.

Lots of folks in the UK can't afford to: buy fresh food; and / or spend the time preparing it; and / or afford a nearby gym; and / or afford to spend time at the gym... there are thousands of people who are struggling to hold down two or even three jobs to pay excessive rent. rates, tax and living costs, care for families and eat well at the same time. Perhaps if these issues were effectively dealt with then where it was just down to lazy bad habits and reluctance to change, then maybe doctors should have the discretion to refuse certain treatment...
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I am slightly underweight by the way... something which I regard as a weight problem in it's own right.

Hm. Never thought of it like that.

A note on the body mass index. The BMI isn't like a set in stone standard because some people who aren't very tall, who weigh a lot, have a lot of muscle. Or they have a high percentage of body fat. Really, what's to be measured is your BMI and your body fat percentage. *shrug* I myself have a terrible eating disorder (ED-NOS, technically) (and willingly admit to it without seeing a therapist), not just horribly disordered eating (although have suffered the disordered eating almost my entire life, or at least since age 9). It's not pleasant knowing that your weight can shift 30 or 40 pounds in under a month and you're only 5'0'' tall. But most of my view on fat people, overweight people, and even normal frightens me but... that's because I can't see clearly enough and my brain interpret it properly. I mean, I look at someone who has a BMI of 15 and almost no body fat (under 5%), and that's gorgeous to me - my aim in life. Someone at entirely normal, like myself at a BMI of 21.5ish just... seems huge. And especially to myself. And, frankly, I'm really stereotypical when it comes to larger people. I can't stand most of them. At least the ones I've come across. And that's quite a lot, living in the good ol' south of the USA. Maybe 2 or 3 of my friends are overweight, one who's actually morbidly obese. I can stand them because they don't have attitudes about their weight, they don't judge openly, and they shower twice a day. I've also OCD if it helps explain some things.

So, from an entirely mental person's point of view... overweight people who don't take care of themselves scare the crap out of me. Ditto with normal sized people. But people who are thinner than a rail... well, they can do whatever they'd like and I don't care. Questions, comments, flames... whatever. There's a reason why I go to counseling when I'm in school.

Like others here have said, its not always that easy for people. My mother isn't the stereotypical obese person, but she is well, fat. She also has diabetes, arthritis, ect. Her weight will likely contribute to an early and possibly painful death. She know this. Her doctors have told her to lose weight and the her children are worried for her. She knows what to do more or less and what would help.

But that knowledge isn't enough to combat the emotional scars that got her to this point. Her childhood, low self-esteem, anxiety and depression, ect. Her need for comfort, lack of concern for herself are enough to crush her half-hearted efforts to change. To change on level with signifigant results that is. Its part of why I think most weight at that level is at least somewhat emotionally caused. People can be surrounded with motivations, but it isn't always enough to cut through all the issues. How to fix that, I don't know. If your life, happiness and children don't motivate you, what would?

zivane: Do you want to change and find a place where you can be healthier and hopefully happier?

I'm not obese. Apparantly I'm 'normal' with a BMI of 24.3, but only just. It's not that I eat more than everybody else, that is apart from nectarines, but I don't think that you can et fat on nectarines. Also, I do much excersize, I do 3 dance lessons and a gym lesson each week and also the two compulsory P.E. lessons at school so I don't think that my weight has anything to do with my lifestyle. I think that some families just have a slower metabolism rate than others. I mean, no one in my family is particularly thin and on my dads side, people aren't really large, but are a little bit wobbly. Even if I try to eat more healthily, nothing happens to me. And nothing happens to me when I eat tonnes either.

However, I think that why obese people find it harder to excersize than others, despite it being more physically diifficult, I think that because they are probably very self-conscious and a bit embarrassed, going out in tight shorts and t-shirt is probably not their cup of tea.

Hmmm, I'm a big girl. Everyone refuses it, but then again, I surround myself with kind people. Even though I could drop more pounds than I'm willing to say, when I see people bigger than me it makes me sad and a little sick. I always say to myself, "At what point to you give up? At what point do you look in the mirror and think, C'est la vie, and keep eating?" It's a serious health risk, and no one knows it better than my fat ass because I've been big since I was a wee little tot.

I remember (as I'm sure every fat girl does) buying my first pair of jeans at around 3rd grade, and having to buy boys' HUSKY. It wasn't that I was eating too much, we were too poor to have goodies and ice cream and all that bad crap, just the essentials. I blame the younger weight problems on genetics. There's no other explanation; I was just as active as other 8 year olds and eating less than them if anything.

Now I'm almost 16, and I still have my weight problem. I do exercise, though not as much as most of my peers do. I have a normal appetite, and eat, again, the same if not less than the girls in my class who're 5'7" and 110 lbs. I went through the "It's not fair" phase, and now I accept thefact that I have to go the extra mile. I think it is genetic a lot of time, but people have to be responsible as well.

I was thinking about it and I'm wondering if anorexia/bulimia and obesity (not just being a bit overweight) aren't two sides of the same coin, depending on the person. One is using the disorder and the induced obsession to cope with life and pain, the other would be drowning it food. This probably isn't profound, but I was pondering how levels of both were going up at the same time. Though the US obsession with unhealthy food, portion sizes and availability likely also has much to do with obesity. Go figure.

apparently children who se their parent obsesed with weight and portion size are at greater risk of being over weight themselves and are more likely to become obsesd with food or dieting.

Healthy isn't the same as obsessed.

I'm deffinitely overweight, even when you take my body type into consideration. The whole reason is because I DIDN'T eat. I was about halfway to anorexia when I think about how much I was eating when I was younger, really. Let me put it this way...

With anorexia, the person doesn't eat anything and exercises fanatically. The weight goes down because the person is using up calories they don't have. In my case, I ate almost nothing but DIDN'T exercise. I was just too tired to. (Honestly, I don't see how seriously anorexic people can exercise, they must be so exhausted with that little to pull from for energy. But I digress...) So I didn't eat (except when I went out with friends, or when my mother actually handed me food, a very rare occurance) and I didn't exercise, so my metabolism went way way down. I was basically eating enough food to fuel going to school and sleeping, and whenever there were extra calories or nutrients left over my body stored them as fat. My doctor explained it by saying my body was in starvation mode; it was making me almost hybernate and saving everything possible.

Now I'm actually losing weight by eating more. I've started trying to eat three balanced meals a day (quite a feat when you feel enormous guilt whenever you eat alone or decent sized portions) and I've started exercising regularly. It's only been a year but I've managed to safely lose 45 lbs. I'm probably going to be looking at a good decade or so of working on my health, and at the end I'm STILL not going to look like a model, because my hips (the actual bones) are shaped much wider than average.

So in the end, I'll be working my ass off to lose weight, but I'll still look fat. And honestly, I don't particularly care. I've finally found peace with myself. And my whole thoughts on the subject are that as long as my doctor, my fiancee (who's a hard-core butt man), and I are fine with my body, noone else matters.

well..honestly..everyone i know is fat. i dont care. i'm skinny , they are fat lol. big deal. i dont really care about appearances. but beleive me, i feel blessed to be 6'0" and weigh 130, especially in America of all places. but eh. i dont feel much...they are just like anyone else.

Firstly you're too skinny I'm 128 and 5.3
secondly don't you think there's somthing wrong when everyone you know beeing overweight or obese causes the reaction of MEH they're all fat but I'm not HA?

It might not be Erin's fault s/he's "too skinny." I have plenty of tooth pick friends who eat like mad all day long and never gain a pound. One of my friends ate chocolate covered oreos, like the whole bag, and not only didn't get ill, but didn't gain an ounce. Now if I had eaten the same thing, I might've gained five or six pounds. Some of these people with metabolisms like that want to gain weight, but their bodies won't let them. I constantly tell them that if they're not gaining weight, they're at least clogging their arteries (I suspect some of them ARE one big arterycovered in skin) but hey, it's their life. And most of these toothpicks lose such metabolism when they're 28 any way.

I think Erin's "lol" was more light hearted than, "I'm so skinny, and they're all FAT FAT FAT FAT HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!"

I know some people have a nutso meatabolism I know woman 5.8 and 106 she actually has serious health issues particularly as she's now 45 but Enin has repeatedly posted in this childish I'm an idiotic 12 year old with no ritalin who wishes to express an ignorant badly thought out opinion without the decency to even make an effort to punctuate properly compleat with all the ums,er,and ehs I'd fit into a conversation in which I was making fun of an extremly stupid bimbet like totally.
Not that I have any particular issue with her in general but when she posts like this in the issues forum it does give one an impression.

Ever heard the phrase "practice what you preach"?

A few commas and some quotation marks would have made that readable, as it was I got lost so many times that I decided it wasn't worth my while trying to decipher the meaning of that hideously extended sentence.