I'm staying at my parent's house this weekend. I got up to go to church with my mom. As I was going out to the car (mine exploded; long story), my mom saw that I was wearing my baggy black synthetic-material pants, a longsleave t-shirt and a Pink Floyd t-shirt over it. She told me to go inside and change. I asked why and she said, "It's not appropriate in the house of God." I didn't go to church today because of that. We had a long fight about it where I told her that she's full of bullsh*t and she cares too much about what other people think (which is true). Since when has one's appearence had such a significance in one's life in areas like these? Now, I'm not stupid. I don't go to a job interview in baggy-ass black jeans and my infamous black jean jacket and neither do I go on a date with a chick for the first time wearing nailpolish and eyeliner (I save that for weekends), but when it comes to casual times, school or church, I don't see why I should curb my style. Nailpolish and makeup aren't what I wear nomally and I wouldn't wear it to church, but what's wrong with a "Pink Floyd: The Wall" shirt and black pants? I've noticed in the bible, it says nothing about what we should or shouldn't wear in church. In fact, it denounces wearing extravagant clothing to impress others. Upon saying this, my mother said something about "honering thy father and thy mother," but I came back with Christ bringing, "not peace, but a sword" and "deviding parents against children, etc. for righteousness' sake." Just now, I thought of what Christ said about how any who love his parents, wife or anyone more than Him, then that person is unfit to follow Him. Then she gave me her over-used argement that it's similar to her wearing revealing clothing places and what-not. First of all, I really don't give a rat's ass, second of all, she told me that when I'm a father, I'll feel the same way. I told her, once again, that she's full of bullsh*t and she mentioned, with a little male-directed aggression, that I may not be like that toward my sons, but I will definately be like that toward my daughters. I just gave up with it then. Is there anyone els who getss me on this, including or excluding religeon?

i understan d.. my dad is always ragging on me aobut what IM wearing, wether it be to skewl or on the weekends "U cant wear that! its not approperiate" what is then?? "thats WAY too short!" it goes doen to my knee's dumb ass! "u cant wear that to school! i dont want boys loking at you!" its a freaking dress! it goes down to my calves and its not even revealing! what is wrong with you man!! bah. and then when i do cover up everything possible its "its to hot to wear that, go put on shorts" or "why dont u ever wear gurly stuff anymore? u look so pritty in dresses" bah! what is with parents!? he gets on my case when i wear a skirt.. he gots on my case when i wear anything! >_< then when i decide im done wiht his bullsh*t and wear duickies with a tank top he says it looks fine >_< gah.. parents.. i dont understnad them

As far as church goes, I agree with you. I go dressed up, as I go with my parents, though I hardly ever take off my trechcoat at all. My parents have given me the reason of "It's showing your best to God", but I think that clothes are the least of God's worries about us. It doesn't matter what you wear, but what you feel, really.

As far as clothing in general, I almost always wear all black. No, I am not depressed... I'm like LGG in the "Space Hopper" episode. I just like black. It's my favorite color. For show choir (our outfits are black, I'm so happy), we had to dress up in "60's"-like clothing, and I wore color. Namely, pink, purple, green and blue. With hearts. And people made a huge deal out of it, and they say I look good in pink (I think I look better in darker colors, but anyway...), and that I should wear color more often. I don't see why I really matters. I wear what I want, and that's what really matters.

At my college (full of pervy old men who take drugs and stare at my tits in French class) there's a new rule for the girls:if we're caught wearing clothing that shows our midriffs,its an instant suspension.I just find it highly amusing that we can't show a bit of belly,be it accidental or not,yet the male teachers who enforced the damn rule don't mind us walking round with ridiculously low cut tops. our response?all the girls in my year came in in bikini tops for the day,and removed our coats only in the presence of a female teacher.so HA.

Secondly-jesus christ man,should it matter what u wear "in the house of God" is there an official church-goer dress code or something?think not.I mean,God and Jesus walked round half the time in sandals and a white cloth draped over themselves,leaving little to the imagination!how naughty

Yup. I have a pair of particularly large raver-esque marroon pants I adore for being so comfortable, but my mother detests them to hell and back. After our first argument, she stopped caring whether I wore them or not. =) I'm not bible equipped enough to whip out Jesus and the saints on her, but I do have some arguments of my own up my sleeve.

Ha. I've said that on several occasions. I don't believe in dress codes in the first place. I mean, it's understandable for one to tone it down for certain occasions, but when not in certain institutions or situations, what's the point? I joke aroud with my almost-sister-in-law about her wearing low-cut shirts when she comes over (she's like my little sister, fer cryin' out loud), but I'm not serious. When I'm a minister, I want to have a service for alternative folks who aren't into conventional or traditional churchiness (if it's not a word, it is now) simply because it's been one of those things that have turned folks away from church. Jeez. It's hard seeing a problem when the ones around you don't (present company excluded).

Bah. My parents give me "looks" but they've told me time and again (usually when I'm wearing something they think is "unappropriate") that I can wear what I wish, so long as I know what people will say/think.

I don't think they know that I don't particularly care what people think, but hey... Whatever.



Also... God couldn't possibly care what we wore. Adam and Eve were naked for heaven's sake. I mean, you can't possibly believe that they had perpetual floating leaving hiding their privates all the time.

course there was, they were held in place by scotch tape...god invented that on the 4th day i think...because the fish kept falling apart

the idea of sunday best is ages old anyway, people used to dress up for everything even flying! i guess it's stuck with church for some bizarre reason...and in harrods....thats just wierd, then thing i really don't understand is why some club and pubs insist that you have to wear shoes i mean common, its not like you can see them under my jeans! well you can a little but who's looking at shoes anyway?!

It's funny how my mom cares about what others think while I've adopted the I-don't-give-a-rat's-ass-what-people-think additude (assuming we're not going on a date for the first time). Eh well. And what I don't get is how convenience stores say "No shirt. No shoes. No Service." but if you go in with shirt and shoes and no pants, they look at you like you're nuts . Eh, well. Screw 'em, I always say.mI want to have my brother Rick take random pictures of me while I'm wearing just whatever and analyzing them nice and well.

humanity is a social creature and we all wish to be social and get along with people in our own way

many insecure people feel that to get along that our appearance is the most important thing that people care about, and that if we dont fit in with their Idea of how people should look than you have to change.

this idea can in extreeme cases also be linked to racism, sectarianism and homophobia

me i personally dont care and feel that everyone should live their life to the full.

as long as no-one gets hurt - i dont see any problems

I always wondered about that...

or they look at your nutz

Heh. I'd like to try that, but that's unbefitting.

You all ought to respect your parents more, after all, without them, you would not be here. And they cared for you and clothed you. This is so hypocritical, if you think your ma is stupid then move out and see how you like it.


Pity there aren't TOUGH parents with balls and a Black Rubber Strap...heh then let's see you talk.

yeah but your parent have to respect yopu as well as you decide where they go when their old

Sure they must respect you. But calling your mum a dumbass and saying she is full of bullshit is wrong.

You really are an asshole, Wallace. I'm not one to agree with the masses, but considering there are a lot of folkd here who think you are a complete asshole, then I'd have to say I agree with the majority here.

BTW- I do live on my own. I come home to visit mylittle sister, also known as my little angel. And what's with your apparent obsession with balls and black rubber strap-ons, I mean straps. Oh, sorry. Is my smart-assness showing?

that just depends on how comfortable they are talking to each other like that.

some families dont even raise there voice to each other and have very unhealthy realtionships where as others can scream at each other for 20 minutes and become closer for it and be very comfortable as a family unit

every family is different and have there own ideas of what is and what isn't acceptable

I know people whose moms ARE dumbasses, and who take away their children's ability to move out (money, transportation, etc.). Some people's parents deserve the insults, and that's not for you to decide... you don't know them.

well said

My family is the kind that fights like animals sweaing at eachother, yelling, screaming, theatening divorce, but a half hour later, we all make up. Jesus, you should see me and my brothers. But that's not the point. The point is we love eachother and we don't take things personally. I know my mom's a loon, but I still love her because her heart's in the right place. That's all that matters.

They love their kids, and they don't want anything to happen to them. Don't you understand parenttal love? Sometimes it blinds them to truth, but it's also what holds a family together.

exactly because you and you're family work that way and its healthy for you to do that

but for some it aint

everypeople different

True dat.

and in some family's parents dont lie to there children and resent them.

my family are always stright with me and scream ans swear at me if i mess up big time and if they didn't thats when i'd worry.

i have a healthy relationship with my immediate family that i wouldnt trade for anything accept inner peace and the secrets of the universe because well lets face it i've been after them for a while

They just want you to grow up into a fine young master. One day, you'll look out of the window of your huge corporate sector building, straighten your tuxedo and think: My parents helped me to become a man.

Or you can just be a bumhead and grow up to be a druggie. Kids these day don't want any control...

..listen to me, I sound 40.

woops, looks like this 'ere thread is becoming another "William Wallace is an A***hole" thread.

You shoudl hear the things my mum and I say to each other. of course, we make up instantly. Same goes for when my father and mum are fighting. Looks like the bleedin' house is going to be minus one. They actually threaten each other with death.

Also I'm pretty sure you've never been chastised with a belt.

so bill you're saying that unless our parente beat us we will become drug addicts and that al sucessfull people had the crap kicked out them by the people who gave them life and the people they should be able to trust most

personally on this subject i think your full of shit and you are trying to get the reputation of an asshole by portraying yourself to be one and trying as hard as possible to fit the immage

My parents did help me become a man without hitting or beating me, although they left most of he becoming a man up to me. I was chastised with a belt on one or two occasions, but my father immediately apaoligized. I remember him once saying, "I don't want to hit you because I'm afraid you'll get older and start hitting me." That's one of the many reasons why I won't hit my kids. That and you can get them better in a lot of ways. There have been times I've been diciplined in ways I would have rather been beaten with a Singapore cane.

My father has told me on many occasions that I have grown into "a fine young master" without beatings or forcing me to sell out, which I assume is what you learned from being hit with belts and rubber straps (which now I can only imagine what you do with).

I don't want to be in a corporate office building. My parents had the decency not to beat me into selling out. And neither am I a druggie and I detest you insinuating that. Besides, control comes from within, not at the end of a belt.

And it was you who turned this intp a "Wallace is an asshole thread" by being an asshole.

The most I get is my family and friends and co-workers for that matter, freaking out if I wear dressy clothes an make up. Hell on halloween everyone was gushing over how gorgeous I aparently looked with make up on.

At my old job people got in trouble for not wearing black socks. It was dress code and had to be followed. Dress code = Polo shirt, clean ironed and tucked in, black slacks, belt, black socks, and nice shined black shoes. My new job is strictly T-shirt and jeans. I just have to wear an apron, and not show off my tats, or breasts, or wear my body jewerly. Which is nothing new.

When I used to go to church (stopped going when I was 9) they would not let you in to the chapel if you were not dressed nicely. Women had to wear dresses and they had to be below the knees. Anything higher was too sinful. Guys had to wear nice pants, and a nice shirt at least. They did however like if a tie was worn. Any other place in the church was ok to enter not dressed up, but if you went into the chapel in jeans and a T watch out.

i also stopped going to church pretty young, i did start againb for a while in my early(er) teens but i stopped for that precise reason, i was made to feel uncomfortable because of the way i dressed and quite frankly im comfortable enough in my own beliefs (which were always kind of eclectic anyways) to worship on my own. it hurt at the time that i felt bad going into a church because i got stared at but now i realise that Spirit doesnt care what we look like when we worship just so long as we know we're doing the right thing in the right way for ourselves. i personally couldnt dress up and be false in the eyes of God, i am who i am. thats all there is to it.

*hasn't had time to read whole thread and will read later to make sure I haven't said something some one else has already*

I dont get it either on why you have to look good if you go to church...next time you go try what I did...wear lots of eyeliner, black lipstick, a spiked dog coller, all black clothes, and black nailpolish...it's fun to see peoples reactions...

(I tried this at a morman church and it looked like they were about to stone me....it was amusing..)

Of course God doesn't have a dress code. If He is truly omnipotent he can see you buck naked whenever you undress, he can watch you on the toilet, he can watch you having sex. Nothing is going to phase God, but you might well upset some prudish folks who think that dressing sensibly is more appropriate whilst praying. The reality is that you are dressing for other people, not for God. And other people suck. That's just life I suppose, but you shouldn't go out of your way to upset other members of your congregation - prayer is meant to be a positive occasion after all.

And William, had you ever stopped to consider the possibility that you are the one making every thread a "William is an A**hole" thread? Perhaps if you temper your language you will have an easier time here.

HA!not me,i was made in a freezer,no wonder my nipples are so damn hard



I have nightmares about growing up to be like that-I AM PETER PAN,I AM! all it takes it faith,trust,and pixie dust!

Lol thanks,just put me off having sex EVER again why dontcha?

P.S-good call about the every thread thing-tis true Will,fraid uv got urself a hate club!

Well, it's nice to see a fine mix between theological dress code discussion and employment dress code discussion. We were talking about it in philosophy class. I had worn myself out defending homosexual marriage, so I didn't address the issue (and not to get too off-topic, but not-too-long ago, we learned about religeous relativism, which means that all religeons are relative to eachother [not true] and is perpetuated by the whole "well, God says so" arguuement [keep in mind, it was religeous relativism that made the Al Quaeda guys run those planes into WTC]; I beat this chick hard with biblical history and how the Greeks had a bunch of words for "homosexual" and the ones mentioned in the New Testament refer to gay temple prostitutes and, well, let's just say that giving to church isn't what it used to be; plus, Jesus was the one who fulfilled the Jewish law, that's why we're allowed to eat pork on Fridays and not have to wait until the evening to eat after we go to the bathroom). I figure they knew damn well how I feel, so what would be the point in arguing.

If I do that at my church, no one would do anything 'cause it wouldn't suprise them in the least.

Some parents do not love their children, and their stupidity tears a family apart.

I happen to have a healthy relationship with my parents, but I know people in situations where their parents are just plain stupid, and blow up over the smallest things. Once, a friend of mine's mother took the TV, VCR, and other electronics and drove away and didn't come back for a day because her daughter didn't have a pen. Her words were, "I'm sick of this and I'm sick of you." This situation is not exaggerated, I swear on my grave.

never said you were a druggie, never said you were a fool. You took my word too well. I was speaking about your future.

I was chastised with a belt, oh, say, 4 times a week, often just to help me grow. That doesn't happen nowadays, though. And if your father is stupid enough to back down, he is not a good father. A son must learn to fear and respect his father, and to respect his mother. You do neither, and don't say now that I have said it that you respect your mother and father. You don't. You have no respect for society and for your parents.

Control comes from the end of a belt, that has been made clear. My father once told me he does not whip me for no reason at all, but for me to learn responsibility. His father beat him, and so on. I'm used to that. Obviously caning is the best way to be educated. My father is a successful, and smart businessman, popular and friendly. See what corporal punishment does to you?

*sigh* I give up...you kids are wearing me out.

I feel so weary, so tired, watching you young people make your parents look bad,

You first look at a person, you don't know what they're really like, would you expect a person wearing clean, smart, expensive clothes to be more respectable than someone wearing any old trash which is crinkled and stained (i know its an extreme but its just an example), of course you would! you'll say it doesn't matter but first impressions count, now we all know any gibbon can put on smart clothes, doesn't make them rational, intelligent individuals....in fact in a lot of cases the opposite can apply...and one day someone will work that out

yeah, but you should at least look like something other than a ragamuffin.

Fear and respect my father via beatings? Three words: God help you.

Living in the southern United States, my father, grandfather (born in Cuper, Fife), uncles, brothers and I sit back and laugh at the "spare the rod, spoil the child" philosophy. We think it's utterly hilarious. "Yeah, ya gotta beat yer kids," my father would say in a Georgian accent, "That's how they know ya love em. It's good fer em. Why da ya think they act up so much?" I don't give a rat's ass, but my brothers, sisters and I love and respect our parents, even if they are crazy and don't beat us. Yeah, we yell and scream and let the fur fly, but at the end of the day, I'm proud of my parents and wouldn't trade them for any others and vice versa.

My parents have instilled me with values (the real ones, not *beatin the hell outta yer kids cuz it's good fer um*) like honesty, integrity, hard work, honor, thinking for myself, dedication, standing up for one's beliefs, empathy, love, sympathy, virtue and pride in oneself. My father has raised five children (two of which were adopted) and, without beating the hell out of us (save the times when he himself was somewhat out of control). He describes the worst of his children as, "Crazy and somewhat egocentric, but utterly hardworking and successful (my older sister Rach who works as a market representitive for an insurence company)," and the best of which as, "Having more common sense and direction than most of the people I've ever met (my younger brother Rick who wants to be a pro skater and start his own board company ["Hey, if you can make money at it, go for it," my pop says] with an education in computer science ["Just in case," pop says]). My brother Tim (adopted), my sister Gabrielle (my angel) and I fall somewhere in the middle. My parents have led by example and I follow their example because I understand the values set before us, save my mother's slight vanity.

I'm sorry I don't fear my father. It must be the hippie in my that tells me I should love my dad just as he loves his dad (who didn't beat him or my uncles, one of which is one of the richest men in northern Florida). My mom (a loon ball whom I love and wouldn't trade for any other) is a teacher with a degree in pediatric psychology (and I'm pursuing a master's in abnormal psychology). She tells me that fear and a lack of affection from one's father can lead to serious maladjustment. Most of the serial killers I've studied had little to no attention from their fathers save the occasional beatings. Now, I'm not saying that everyone beaten by his father will turn into a serial killer, but there's enough maladjustment going around and I don't want to add to the pile. I'm not a psychologist (at least not a certified one yet), but I'm willing to bet that there's a certain amount of maladjustment in your family, perhaps a submissive mother and internal, repressed feelings of hatred toward your father (prime case for an Oedipus complex). I'm also willing to bet that you're pop has problems showing deep affection for his kids (I mean, the surface stuff is easy, but there's a lot more to it) and repressed anger toward his pop as well as a psychological family tree of maladjustmen going back years if not centuries.

My father, too, is a "successful and smart businessman, friendly and well liked." Once again, Granddad didn't beat him (nor does he advocate it) and, lo and behold, he owns two houses and a pair of properties he plans on developing and selling. My uncle Curt, as I've said, is one of the richest men in north Florida. My uncle Derrick ("Uncle D.J., we call him) leads a life similar to my granddad's brother: Simple content and comfortable, working construction (which is quite lucrative) and dealing junk (which is even more lucrative). None of these men beat their kids. Would you call them stupid to their faces? Would you look in my grandfather's eyes and tell him that he was a poor father to his three sons? If you would, I would call you a liar and a fool. I respect all of these men out of love, not fear and that is what makes them good men.

Of course I don't respect society. Neither do my brothers, my father, my uncles or my grandfather. If society were worth respecting, we would. Here are some quotes these men have made on society:
Granddad: "These Goddamn people are stupider by the day."
Dad: "I hope to God you kids don't end up contributing to the downfall of society (we'll be in our late twenties before my dad stops calling us 'kids')."
Uncle D.J.: "It took Rome roughly four-hundred years to fall. The US is doing it in half the time."
Uncle Curt: "All these damn people want are handouts. What kind of crap is this? We never got any handouts and we were poorer than them."
Rick: "F*ck society, (insert Ri's real name). It's not like they matter."
Tim: "God, people are so stupid."
Ri: "Society's going downhill fast. Now you know why I refuse to conform (mentally more that physically)."
Dad: "God, some people need to be taken out back and shot."
Ri: "You know, it scares the hell out of me that Gabrielle has to grow up in this society."
Rick: "Goddamn these mutants. People really do equal sh*t."
Ri: "Why is it all the stupid people do the most breeding?"
Dad: "I still think people should get liscenses to have kids."
Granddad: "I moved your dad and uncles out of Jamaica because there was no future for them there. All the people there were too damn stupid. Unfortunately America's becoming the same way."

Thanks for predicting my future oh-so-brilliant sage. If you were here longer, you'd know, just as most of the people around here do, that I plan on having a career in ministry while writing, investing and starting my own production company. I plan to have a service where you can "come as you are" regardless of what you wear (even if you look like a "ragamuffin," so long as you wear something [nothing against nudists; it's just not my style]) because that's the way God intended it to be. Call me a hippie (and chances are I'll say "thanks"), but I believe that since we come into this world naked and at the Final Judgement we will be naked clothed only in our Salvation, clothing doesn't really matter. I don't care what you wear so long as you're not a complete asshole.

To be honest, I used to be a druggie and an alcoholic, but thanks to my parents (who didn't beat the pot, booze and speed out of me), my brothers and my sisters (yes, even my angel Gabrielle), I'm now drug-free and much happier and healthier.

If you still think my dad's stupid and my mother is an unfit mom, keep in mind that, not only have they raised five kids, but they've read stacks of books on parenting and child psychology (including my mother's textbooks which are quite interesting) and my mother is a Montessori school teacher (hence the degree). In her spare time, my mom also teaches parenting classes down at the community center and is a "buddy" for a few new moms (some of which are her students' parents), meaning that the call up asking for advice on parenting. How's that for "stupid and unfit"?

It's mine, my mother's and my father's firm belief that when the Bible reads, "Spare the rod, spoil the child," that the Bible was written mainly for working-class folks (carpenters, shepards, laborers, etc) and by that it refers to when hearding sheep, the shepard uses his rod to guide the sheep along the path. Jesus was, "the good shepard" and I don't recall him beating his followers "to teach them responsibility." So, in a sense, my parents don't "spare the rod."

BTW- Next time I visit my family (and my angel whom the four of us older siblings also have a hand in raising), when my granddad, uncles, brothers and I are kicking back, I'll mention what you said about all of this. It'll make for a good laugh.

P.S.- Sorry to all if I've made spelling errors or doubled letters. The nerve disorder in my arms is acting up today pretty badly.

One, my father loves me. Sure, he can be a f*ckwit at times, but he makes sure I have clothes on my back, a Live steel blade, food, and books and games. Brutal beatings have been considered normal in my family, since we had very old-fashioned values. I do not have any repressed anger toward him. he did what had to be done.

Also, my father never beat any of us-my brothers- James Wallace, Paul Wallace, and Myself-once we came of age, which was when we were 10. So he didn't have to beat us all the time, just when we were very young.


So you have been proven wrong with both things.

What are you doing, jerking off stalefish? I never said the latter. For the love of f*cks sake, are you on acid or something?

We've been raised with old-fasioned values, too. Last time I checked, honesty, integrity, hard work, honor, thinking for oneself, dedication, standing up for one's beliefs, empathy, love, sympathy, virtue and pride in oneself were nothing new.

And do you really believe society is worth respecting? It sure as hell isn't in the US and my Granddad says that Scotland's being infected by the stupidity of the rest of the world.

And what in the sh*t (God, I wish we could swear here) is a Live steel blade? Is it opposed to a Dead steel blede? God, I feel like I'm surrounded by f*cking nut jobs, present company especially. Jesus Christ. This is re-goddamn-diculous.

I fail to see how beating anyone will instill moral values in them. You just can't beat morals into a person.

its ok love. ill say i dont care what you wear (and in the bedroom little is better ...*blushes* i didnt say that)

ive gone into dunkin donuts without pants before. they called security and i bolted. i may try it again sometime...but for now im a legend (to myself...i was scared to tell anyone lest the security found em)

i think dresscodes are out of control. its like hte censors...it starts out a good thing, only meant to protect the innocent, but then they abuse their power to the point where we are oppressed to do what they say.

me? personally i think clothes are uncomfortable, and if there werent legal issues involved id wear panties to skool everyday (silk ones...they are SOOOO damn comfortable). my little amount of input.

My pop really doesn't care about what I wear. He just doesn't like nailpolish, eyeliner or lipstick. He says they make us look girlie. My mom, on the other hand, is completely insane about said appearence enhancements. She also doen't like a lot of the t-shirts I have, like The Wall one.

Wonder why you haven't been banned for this type of language yet. This is the worst I have ever seen on this site.

When it comes to what I believe in, I'll swear and shoot my mouth off 'til I'm blue in the face. If that's all I can do, I'll do it, not just here, but everywhere.

this from someone who just keeps getting banned

amazing

Growing up, my mom always had something degrading to say about what I was wearing, unless it was something she suggested. Mostly when it came to school...Mom started out early on in my life telling me I was fat (from being overweight now and looking back at pictures of me then, I really want to just slap her for that...I was SKINNY), so I'd never want to "show off" anything I had, since I believed I didn't have anything to show off. Then, when I would dress in baggy clothes to hide my "fatness", she'd ridicule me for dressing like a "bag lady" and say "Why don't you ever want to look nice?" Hmmm, gee, mom, maybe because you did such a good job of convincing me that I was so ugly I made everything I wore look like crap, so why should I try? She was trying to get me to dress like some sort of prephead from the 50s...she wanted me to wear skirts and dresses all the time (pants should only be for working around the farm!), and fuzzy sweaters...I fought that one, the rest of my family fought that one (bless them) by always getting me t-shirts and jeans and the like for christmas....and she eventually relented. But it was still a battle.

As a result, once I finally got over the years and years of self-loathing, I've adopted my father's POV about how to dress: "If it's comfortable, it fits, and you like the way it looks on you, then wear it and screw the rest of the world."

(of course, that really only applies when you're out on your own or if you live with parents who don't pay attention to the way you look, i guess...)

it's easily summed up in a few words: your life, live it for yourself, wear what you like, as long as you're not doing anything with malicious intent it's normally ok, etc etc...

and the beating thing? if it worked for you, ok, good. but please stop insisting it should be a regular thing, it's the people with your POV that could end up abusing troublesome kids and causing them so much hurt, just because they think they obviously haven't beaten them enough yet.

maybe that's a little badly worded...ah well.