Read this

Then post your comments.

I find the whole thing rather disturbing. There's little else I can say.

Is it the site's obvious apocolyptic tone that frightens you, or the data itself?

Personally, it looks like a big advertising ploy to me, not that oil isn't a looming concern, but the whole thing reeks of "PANIC - THEN BUY MY BOOK!"

My initial reaction was similar. However... nagging doubts plague my mind. Some of his arguments make a certain disturbing sense. More so than those of the average self-promoting internet nutbasket, anyway...

Some of it is kind of... Convincing and scary...

1 solar panel system costs as much energy as an SUV... So what? $30,000. Look how much a fossil fuel power source makes us pay for pollution and what not.

Whatever.

Could happen.

I don't really care, this world deserves it.

Karma does go around.

Good game, life. Get used to it and suck it up. Ride your bike rather than drive around your f-cking gas hog of an SUV you lazy bastards.

One of the reasons I will never drive a car. That, and I just don't much like cars.

I agree with Rachel, it does sound a bit like a way to sell books. And despite his exhortations, I am remembering all the other doomsday theorists - many of whom, yes, were very qualified.

I remain skeptical, but slightly worried. Well, no more worried than I was before, really - I always did wonder when the oil would run out. And I always did think that the media wouldn't give it the attention it deserved, and that the public wouldn't hear about it and wouldn't care if it did.

Think of it this way - it could turn out like Mad Max! Except for the cars, obviously.

I always thought it wouldn't run out within our life time...well specifically mine, this might be a good book for the average american* to buy, it may scare them into conserving energy.....maybe....

Solar panels and alternative fuel sources need a lot more research, for example, currently more energy goes into making a solar than they produce in their operational lifespan.


*by average american i mean the ones that drive cars with a massive fuel consumption etc..

Yep, same here. Well... that, and I think the world will be a safer place for all of us if I'm not behind the wheel of a huge vehicle speeding down the road. Hand-eye coordination and all that.

Anyway... the site is disturbing, sure, but it's a bit too sensationalist despite all the facts that are presented. There are some good points, but I can't take something seriously when it begins with the sentence "Civilization as we know it is coming to an end soon".

As for the oil thing, I still blame the SUVs. It's not entirely their fault, and I'm sure that either way this was going to happen sooner are later, but where's the logic in driving huge, gas-guzzling, dangerous vehicles that don't even have much more room on the inside than a regular car? I don't get it. Honestly, if I had my way, those things wouldn't exist.

The sad part is that most people know oil is running out, but they keep driving their SUVs and wasting energy without giving this crisis a second thought. What happened to walking? Or, as EvilSpoon said, riding a bike? Most people who own cars just drive them anywhere, no matter how short the distance. If oil prices do go up dramatically, I won't be all that sympathetic. What goes around comes around, after all.

I'm sure the effects of this will be huge, but all I can really do is try not to be as wasteful as most people. Lucky for me that I live in a city with good public transportation...

... That was rather unsettling. I'm not sure whether or not I should worry. I've heard so many different opinions about when the oil is going to run out, so I'm a bit skeptical about whether or not I should beleive that this one guy suddenly has all the answers.

The thing that scares me the most is the draft issue. As an 18 year old American, this means that if the draft does get reinstated, it will be my generation and my friends who are going to get drafted.

As for SUVs, I've never understood why anyone would want to have one. There's nothing really special or interesting about them.

However, I am excited to say that in approximately 4 months I will be moving into the city and leaving my car behind! Yay! I hate driving, but I currently live in the middle of nowhere, where public transportation is nonexistant.

I welcome the economic crash of the USA and all other major oil consuming nations. The side effects however might not be so pretty, I don't know if this situation will happen in the next two years like this guy is saying, but I believe him when he says that it's going to happen soon, probably in our life times...

Perhaps it's time to start plowing the fields? Or at least researching alternative energy technology. I don't know about that info on solar panels using more energy to create them than they produce, the field has been advancing in leaps and bounds in the last few years, and I recall a eco-friendly block of houses in the news that produce enough excess energy to sell to make a little cash on the side. The houses didn't cost much more than a regular one of similar size... according to the television anyway...

But yeah, worrying, to say the least.

No we dont. What oil. Never heard of no oil in Alberta. Nope none at all

In all seriousness, I asked my uncle about this issue not to long ago. (He works for one of the Senators.) He said it was more likely that the US will run out of clean water before any real oil shortages hit. So at the moment Canada should be more afraid of the US invaiding us for water then oil.
Well the thing is. I think maybe the "experts" should spend a little less time writing articles and such, and maybe spend a little more time coming up with a solution.
I've got one. Stick a bunch of windmills in Saskatchewan, one of the most darn windy places I've been.
If the "end" really is coming, then theres really no use worrying about. It happens, or we manage to prevent it. Either way, its going to snow tomorow, so I think I spend a little more time thinking about what I have to pull out of my closet.

I hadn't even considered that possibility. Doesn't seem very likely to me...at least not anytime soon. But maybe I'm spoiled from living in a pristine area of the US my whole life...with plenty of water to go around. I know some states already get quite a bit of water from Canada, don't they? Some people seem to think all of the US is polluted, that we have no clean water, and that we all drive SUVs. Not the case at all. The majority of the country is quite unpolluted....it's just that the majority of the people live in the smoggy areas.

As far as the oil thing goes...feh. I'm not concerned about it. If I had more time I'd dig into my Physical Geography book and explain why...but unfortunately I don't. So I'll probably edit this post later with that info sometime in the future. All I can remember off the top of my head was that the estimate for our oil supply drying up was not in my lifetime....something like 143 years? I don't remember. But that's at our current consumption rate (well, 2003, anyway...that's when it was published)...which needs to be reduced drastically.

Meanwhile...it will dry up eventually. Though not, I am certain, as soon as this guy seems to think. Steps obviously need to be taken to move us from depending on oil so much to being able to survive okay without it. Riding a bike in my town...isn't an option for most people most of the time. It's far too spread out...it'd take an hour for 75% of the town to reach any of the supermarkets via bike. More public transportation would be good...and I think people would actually use it if gas prices got too high. Right now we have 1 bus. It seats 10, at the most, and you have to call them a day in advance if you want a ride somewhere. Not exactly convenient. But, a giant SUV for a family of 4 isn't necessary. As others have said already, I don't see the point of them. Hardly anyone ever uses their SUV for anything other than grocery shopping...at least among people I know.

It's the webpage of Anxiety. *shields eyes* I don't wanna grow up.

But if you read the link, he says that massive amounts of oil will still be being produced - it just won't be enough, since demand will have risen so high. It doesn't have to "dry up", it just has to be a little less than we need.

Ahh. There was quite a bit of information on there. I only skimmed the very first part of it, honestly.

Well, it still doesn't worry me overmuch. If it was this serious, and the threat of the demand exceeding the supply by that much was real, then more restrictions would be placed on what types of cars we can drive, etc. People I know are already driving less just because gas has risen to over $2 per gallon. I honestly don't see it being a catastrophic problem in my lifetime. I'm not saying that things don't need to change -- obviously, they do -- I'm just saying that I can't seeing it being some monumental problem that casts us into something akin to the bad parts of the Bible anytime soon.

I had a strange ironic moment about this today: last night I read this article, and this afternoon the price of gas hit an all-time record high in my local area. (Ahhhh! how prophetic...) It was relatively amusing.

But then all the goverments really need to do is find an energy source to make up for the difference right. I'm sure its not implausible to find other forms of energy to simply make up for said amount of oil we needed. And alternative methods for getting energy would advance with time, thus advance close to what the oil shortages are.

The second possibilty is tar/oil sands. This is the type of oil we have in Alberta. They estimate that there is more oil in Alberta then close to every oil field in action put together, and Alberta's oil sands only make up 1/3 of the worlds oil sands. The problem at the moment (which is still a work in progress, but improving) is how much it costs to get the oil. But like I said, all things improve with technology. So in the future tar sand will be able to be used at there full ability I believe.

Can't remember where that came from but ah well

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More seriously renewable resources seem to be far less efficient that ones that are irreplacable. How about some system where tax rates are increased inversely proportional to the amount of oil left so people who waste it immediately effect everyone else and start to piss people off, eventually leading to people actually having a reason to look down on others for wasting fuel and suchlike. Probably not gonna work in that form but a similar system where people are given an reason not to waste fuel that has a tangible bad effect on them may work.

On the Matazone Quote Site it's attributed to Commie. Naturally, he's the only one who would come up with something that creative.

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I'm sorry, I tuned out of this doom-mongering as soon as I read this line:


I'm sure it requires some oil, but not a vast amount, surely? And certainly not the amount an oil power plant burns every minute of every day.

Yes, oil is most efficient due to the fact it burns more readily and produces more energy. Yes, it's cleaner than coal as it produces fewer carbons. But this guy misses the point; he's talking like there's no alternative, yet a nuclear facility (as much as I dislike them) will produce far more energy than an equivalent sized oil plant, and will be much less of a pollutant when properly maintained.

It's been common knowledge for the last 2 decades that oil reserves are slowing down in production levels, yet the US has made no steps whatsoever to reducing their dependency on oil. They bemoan the $4 gallon of gas for their cars, yet still drive round in monsters that burn the stuff for fun. Look over here in the UK, your buddies, driving round in efficient cars due to the draconian CO2 tax legislation and our $7 (yes, seven) gallon. They backed out of that conservation treaty thing a few years ago (I don't recall the name, but it had something to do with cutting pollution on a global scale) when they realised just how much they'd have to do. And I don't believe there's any other country on earth that relies so heavily on oil for electricity production.

America seems to have taken the attitude that "Oil is getting low, we're screwed!" Well, as the leading oil consumer, it's time they did something about it, lead the way in showing the rest of the world that it's time to move on to something else. Just because oil is the most efficient fuel form doesn't mean it should be used to the exclusion of everything else. Once oil declines, we won't have a choice, and the US won't be able to stop OPEC from supplying oil to other countries. We should look now, so we have time to develop alternatives and preserve the supplies we have now.

Oh, and if oil decline prevents me from paying my credit card, so what?? I'm sure the bank will be too bankrupt to care by that point...

No! Don't be seduced by his appearance of intelligence and wit!!! He stole it! Everything witty that spews from his mouth is stolen! Invariably!

I have been investigating him for some months now, and have discovered the source of many of his hilarities. He is a fraud, and should be treated as nothing more than that.

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Heh, we got on the Chicago Local News. (I live in the suburbs an hour away.) While most stations are charging $2.05 - $2.09 a gallon, they were doing a report on a Speedway that was charging $1.74. We all think it's funny because they read the gas prices for the locations on the news now. But it's been higher than this before.

I had no idea about this vast conspiracy, Polocrunch. I am further educated on the nature of our "friend" CommieBastard.

Although, I find it interesting that you yourself have, at one point or another, been "seduced" by his intellect. May I respectfully and oh so humbly quote you? "[Sean] oozes wit and intelligence. He ought to be sipping brandy in the drawing room of a country estate right now, not sitting typing in a three-bed terraced in Leytonstone." Thank you.

[/oh the SPAM]

While I would normally condemn spam, this is spam discussing me, so I'll let it pass.


Honestly, depending on whom one believes, don't worry about the oil prices because the killer bees will get to you first. Or our pollution of the atmosphere will become so great that air will no longer be breathable. Or we'll trigger another Ice Age via global warming. Or a virus some shady government project is working on will get loose and spread with frightening speed throughout the world's population. Or nuclear war will precipitate.

Frankly, I'm amazed Damocles has any swords left.

Killer bees don't kill people. They're just more aggressive.

...

No, a killer bee doesn't kill anybody (unless said person is allergic). Bees, however, do. A bee's sting is poisonous. With a single bee sting, it's only enough poison to cause the sting to swell up and itch and bit. With a couple of hundred, you may well die.

Anyway, this is off topic, but I'm afraid that all kind of bees kill people.

Yes! His is an alluring and enticing charm. I myself have indeed fallen under his enchanting spells at times. However, we must battle on in the name of all that is good. To victory! and the defeat of all evil!

[/is it me, or is it getting spammy in here?]

But in relation to this Issue:

We desperately need to find alternative, workable sources of energy - fast. Within fifty years, judging by current trends in economic growth, we'll have exhausted most of our oil, coal and gas reserves.

Wind power is not a very efficient technology, and can prove contentious in countries with a lack of space. The UK is experiencing a backlash towards wind farms because apparently they ugly the countryside up. I personally disagree, but it demonstrates the problems that can be caused by renewable energy sources.

Hydroelectricity is, as we know from lots of experience, very contentious. Damming rivers causes enormous damage to the environment - upstream and downstream. River flows are reduced downstream, and large areas are flooded upstream. The Chinese damming of the Mekong River has caused low water levels in Indochina, causing failed harvests, to cite one example.

Tidal/wave power is still a pretty dodgy technology, and could upset shipping routes. Don't know how viable it really is for generating large quantities of energy.

Solar power is probably our best hope. It's still extremely expensive, but eventually with all of the shortages in other fuel sources it will become economic. It's also becoming much more efficient. At the moment in the UK you can fit your roof with solar panels that look like normal tiles. The government will make up half of the cost (about £10,000), and you make enough energy to be able to sell some back to the National Grid. If I were rich enough, I'd go for it immediately, though mainly because I would no longer need to worry about power cuts.

Other technologies are coming through at the moment too - most notably hydrogen power. Not quite sure how it works, but it looks fairly promising. It'll probably take some decades to refine and cheapen. Nuclear power, the power source we love to hate, is also still viable. It's dirty, it's expensive and it's unsafe (though governments of the Fifties loved to tell us otherwise), but it's pretty efficient. I'm not certain what's going on with geothermal power - presumably it's too unreliable or expensive or just impractical to use.

We don't have to worry too much about power supplies, what with all these improving technologies, but we should think twice about going to war for energy resources like oil. We need to wean our economies off of oil as soon as possible, so that when it does eventually run out we won't be caught with our knickers down.

It's nuclear fusion using hydrogen; they want to harness the mass that turns into energy during the reaction.

That reminds me of John Titor.

Ah, yes... good old nuclear fusion!

I was told all about this possible future energy source many moons ago, and my hazy recollection of it is that it uses nuclear atoms to create energy in a similar way to the Sun (which they alleged was a humungous fusion reactor - bit odd, I always thought it was a star meself...) Considered much better cos, unlike nuclear fission, it's safer, cleaner, more efficient and you don't need to dump a radioactive mass the size of Wales every few weeks...

Last I saw of this, someone had invented a particle accelerator which was capable of producing a modest amount of fusion energy, but it wasn't very stable and required a fair bit of juice to fire the thing up.

I remember seeing a bit about fusion on tomorrow's world, it works but its not stable....apparently they havn't gotten any better at it, it'll probably be sorted by the time the oil thing reaches real crisis levels (conveniently)

Exactly, leopold. ^^

Yeah, fission is ickier.

Well, woo. My first serious foray into the Issues forum has taken off rather well. Consider me pleased.

Granted, much of the site is paranoid doom-mongering, but there is a simple truth within it all - we will run out of fossil fuels some day, and we need to do something about it.

I do wonder if oil will run to dangerously low levels in my lifetime, but, in the same time period, with the current political climate, will we see any serious turn to renewable energy sources? Equally unlikely.

Sadly, sensible voices like ours regularly get drowned out by those who can shout louder (money makes a marvellous megaphone), and action is rarely taken until something has already gone horribly wrong.

Solution? Set up the guillotine and grab yer pitchforks, people - it's revolution time!