Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: Websites
The Other Side forums - suitable for mature readers! > The Other Side forums > Tips and tricks
CommieBastard
How easy it is to design a website? In the relatively near future, I shall need to do this. However, I know almost no HTML. How much will I need to learn in order to set up my site, and where can I learn it all?

The site in question will be a webcomic site - many examples exist.
Greeneyes
I think the 'amount' that you need to have depends on what you are intending to do specifically. If you plan out how everything will be laid out (ie. links in a table and suchlike) it shouldn't be a problem at all. If you're looking for somewhere to start, try looking at the source of an exissting webcomic, then looking up the usage of the tags you don't know, until you can tell which parts of html do what on the site. It's really just a case of looking up what you need. If you just want a blank page with an image and two links, it isn't going to be too complicated.

In conclusion: Design first, learn html later.
CommieBastard
Problem is, there's only so much I can learn from looking at source code:

QUOTE
function MM_findObj(n, d) { //v4.01
  var p,i,x;  if(!d) d=document; if((p=n.indexOf("?"))>0&&parent.frames.length) {
    d=parent.frames[n.substring(p+1)].document; n=n.substring(0,p);}
  if(!(x=d[n])&&d.all) x=d.all[n]; for (i=0;!x&&i<d.forms.length;i++) x=d.forms[i][n];
  for(i=0;!x&&d.layers&&i<d.layers.length;i++) x=MM_findObj(n,d.layers[i].document);
  if(!x && d.getElementById) x=d.getElementById(n); return x;


I have no idea what to make of that (I know it's not HTML).
Greeneyes
...That came from a webcomic? It sort of looks kinda...C-ish. I expect moop will come and beat me shortly for getting that horribly wrong though.

Html is taggy, and nice. Try google. It's full of tutorials.

Edit: Here you go. By the W3C as well. smile.gif

(Other people can probably be much more helpful than me. I'm just bored.)
mooooooooooopo
Webmonkey.com is a pretty good place to start, and they have lots of (well written) tutorials going all the way from basics to rather advanced stuff (see the 'How to library' section on the right, that's the best place to look).

That code you posted looks like javascript and it seems to do _something_ really hacky to do with looping through the entire document looking for...something.

For a webcomic site you'll most likely need to know HTML (obviously), CSS would be handy for changing the look of the site without editing the HTML itself and finally some simple PHP to insert the correct image link and text into a single template page instead of copying a template page over and over for each strip (which would become a nightmare if you want to make major changes to the page layout).
Wytukaze
Well, without seeing the full source, and with the horrible formatting, that JavaScript looks to be a function to retrieve a tag or what have you from the document to be used by other functions for altering or something.
CommieBastard
QUOTE (moop @ Mar 25 2005, 09:05 PM)
For a webcomic site you'll most likely need to know HTML (obviously), CSS would be handy for changing the look of the site without editing the HTML itself and finally some simple PHP to insert the correct image link and text into a single template page instead of copying a template page over and over for each strip (which would become a nightmare if you want to make major changes to the page layout).
*


Keenspace, where I plan to host it because it's free and I am a starving artist, doesn't support PHP.

Thanks for the link!
Wytukaze
QUOTE (CommieBastard @ Mar 25 2005, 09:14 PM)
QUOTE (moop @ Mar 25 2005, 09:05 PM)
For a webcomic site you'll most likely need to know HTML (obviously), CSS would be handy for changing the look of the site without editing the HTML itself and finally some simple PHP to insert the correct image link and text into a single template page instead of copying a template page over and over for each strip (which would become a nightmare if you want to make major changes to the page layout).
*


Keenspace, where I plan to host it because it's free and I am a starving artist, doesn't support PHP.

Thanks for the link!
*



Well, you can use frames, or JavaScript can be used to do most of the functions that PHP can do, but it makes editing the pages confusing and complicated, in the way I'm thinking to solve the template idea, anyway.
oscarhilton
QUOTE (CommieBastard @ Mar 25 2005, 07:24 PM)
How easy it is to design a website? In the relatively near future, I shall need to do this. However, I know almost no HTML. How much will I need to learn in order to set up my site, and where can I learn it all?

The site in question will be a webcomic site - many examples exist.
*



Websites are quite easy to do. (I know my site isn't the best thing in the world but hey?) All you really need is dreamweaver. I know Its like 400 or something but it really is worth your money. But anyway if you dont want to spend your cash on it you can download it, trial version, and crack it usiong a crack site (there are hundreds on google) Once you have this program you can do pritty much anything if you just read the read me file and learn the basics from the site.
I wasn't much help but anyway wink.gif bi
CommieBastard
From my time working on a website (from the standpoint of providing content rather than actually working on the site) I know that Dreamweaver makes some damn dirty code. Our designer would always use it, and then our coder would scream and throw things as she had to sort through horrible code to try to fix something. So, thanks, but no, I think I'll avoid Dreamweaver.
DarkInferno
*shudder* if you use dreamweaver make sure you go over the code when your finished and edit almost all of the tags, you will cut almost half out the size of your page (I've seen pages created with DW that were 1/5th the size after the tag were concatinated and the unused tags removed.

Edit: I actually started writing before commie, just forgot to press post.
CommieBastard
So right now I'm looking at Canaca. The prices seem too good to be true - are they? And is there anything missing from the Bronze Plan that I'd need?
Mata
Hm. Well, it is a little to good to be true, but an adequate basic package. It doesn't leave a lot of room for expansion if you want to make your site more sophisticated though.

I wouldn't like to get a site going that didn't have mySQL and myPHPadmin on it (those are both the standard database systems, one runs them, the other is your interface into them).

PHP is largely built to devour databases, so there's not a lot of point in having PHP without them.

I know lots of people say that Dreamweaver creates loads of pointless code, but that's mainly because people aren't using it correctly. Most webdesign magazines still rate it as the best web-design software, and I agree with them. (Don't even think about Frontpage!)

I highly recommend getting the book 'Foundation Dreamweaver MX 2004' published by Friends of ED. It teaches you lots of good design practise and how to use Dreamweaver to create a really professional website from scratch. I also found their book 'Foundation Webdesign' to be very useful for helping me get my head around CSS.

If you want to make your life easier in the long run then I stongly suggest learning basic PHP. If you keep your site running long enough then it will eventually become essential. PHPNuke comes highly recommended to me as a content management system, i.e. a way of making it easier for you to put new stuff on your site without fiddling around and updating loads of pages (PHPNuke is included in the Silver package). I've never got around to using it, but it is apparently very good and I think would be useful for a frequently updatd site like a webcomic.
Wytukaze
Oo, Foundation Web Design.. I have that book! Somewhere. It was bought for me for a Christmas, but I used it to get my head around JavaScript.

On a less spammy note, I would seriously recommend that book. It teaches you all the basics of HTML, CSS, JavaScript and Flash, which gives you a damn solid grounding in all the important stuff.

Oh, final point, never buy a HTML-only book. It's not worth it, seriously, I learnt HTML from a reference guide to tags my friend wrote when he was bored, and that was just a table with tags and functions.
Mata
HTML really is pretty easy to pick-up very fast. I was given about half an hour's instruction in it when I was at university and by the next week I was teaching him new things!

CSS layout is a bit different... That can be a real pain to get your head around, but it's lovely when you get there (my main site layout is done with CSS, not HTML tables).

People might be interested to know that I found this package for Commie:

http://www.nothsa.com/scripts.php

Kamikaze Comic Manager seems to be the thing that will help the most because in theory it should take away all the tricky things! I'm actually considering having a go with it myself at some point. It sounds like fun, and if the package really does make it easy to set up a webcomic then it might be a nice distraction at some point in the future.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.