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Feyliya
This is just being written as a catharsis for me. No real response is necessary, so this entire thread can be completely skipped over. I just would feel better writing it all out and getting it out of my system. And yes, this is going to be a ginormous post.

Okay, so growing up I had no friends. Seriously, none. So when I finally made friends in 10th grade, those relationships meant more to me than anything in the world, and I did as much to nurture them as I could. Three people stood out most of all, who at the peak of things I considered equally to be my best friends: Brent, Jessica, and Ashley (her name has been changed). Brent and Jess are still very very close to me, and I still consider them to be the best friends I could ever have. Both have had their pains (Jess is still having some severe depression problems), but both have grown and matured as time has gone on. Ashley, on the other hand, seems to have just stagnated.

It all started very shortly after leaving high school. I went on to Clemson University, Jess went to Tri County Tech to pursue an art degree (or graphic design, or something else along those lines that she hadn't decided on yet), and Ashley went to Southern Wesleyan University to pursue....well, she couldn't decide. But her decision to go to college meant so much to her and to all of us as she was the first one in her family to ever step foot on a college campus as a student. In fact, she was one of the very few members of her family to even graduate high school. I was so proud of her; we all were, and she was proud of herself.

College was taken care of for her. She didn't have many merit-based scholarships as her grades hadn't been all that teriffic in school, but she had a good few need-based ones. Also, a relative had left her a large sum of money upon passing that was to go for her education. It was enough that she could go to any college she chose and pursue a degree and not have to pay. She was the only one of our clique who truly had the financial means to go to college and not come out debt-ridden at the end.

A semester after starting college, she dropped out of Southern Wesleyan. She said that the college was too religious (even though she was a rather religious Christian herself). Honestly, I didn't think too much of it then as I was dealing with my own problems (depression, severe illness, loneliness due to being completely cut off from all my friends due to schedule conflicts, etc....). Besides, being Pagan I understood how Southern Wesleyan might be too religious.

The next semester she enrolled in Tri County Tech and I put the episode from my mind. She said she was going to get low-level classes done there then transfer to Clemson University so that she would have a chance to get more scholarships (presuming that she had good grades in her Tech classes, that is). Understanding how she might want to hold on to some of her trust fund money beyond college, once again I thought nothing of it. It was a smart idea. I moved to Seattle confident in thinking that Ashley would finish college faster than I would, though she graduated a year later. Her future seemed secure at the time; it was Jess I was worried about (she has the worst case of clinical depression I have ever seen).

After moving to Seattle I dropped in and out of communication with Jess and Ashley and Brent. At times I didn't have internet access, at times I didn't have phone, and I'm a horrible corrispondant to boot. I just can't keep in touch with people, no matter how much I may want to. During this time, Ashley began a systematic process of turning her life from a progressive road that would lead her out of her Southern family's footsteps to a life that I cannot understand her allowing herself to choose.

First she quit Tri County Tech completely. She picked up a full-time job at the local Subway. (I suspect she did this because her mother began to run afoul of creditors again, but that's purely speculation.) She began dating a married man. She of the high moral ground and strict Baptist religion began dating a married man. A MARRIED MAN. She shrugged it off over and over when everyone tried to talk to her about it. He's a friend of her brother's, he has been separated for a year, he's saving up for a divorce.....the excuses she came up with went on and on.... She's always had poor taste in men (something I blame on her father's louse-ness and alcoholism and her mother's constant bed-hopping from one jerk to another), but this was lower than any of us ever thought she'd go. Then she moved in with him and began sleeping with him, and we all dropped it because we knew that picking at it more would make her cling to him.

So far she's been with him for over a year. They live in a run-down house owned by the mother of another friend of her brother's. They have 3 house-mates. They (meaning Ashley and her "boyfriend") are the only ones that pay rent and utilities. David (the married guy "boyfriend") is supposed to be working a fantastically high-paying factory job (really rather low-paying for a supposed career, but okay for the South, anyway), but he still doesn't have the money for a divorce (something which I'm sure is fairly cheap, considering the ammount of times Ashley's broke mother has done it). I mentioned that he's working a factory job, let me also mention that he's never taken any college coursework at all. Ashley is the only one of the two of them with a car. In fact, David doesn't even have his driver's liscence, he bums rides from everyone else. He has very low prospects and no foresight beyond working this same factory job for the rest of his life, regardless that factory jobs are migrating to China and other developing countries faster than new jobs can develop. She deserves so much better, but all she will do is whine, "but I love him...."

Ashley occasionally mumbles about going back to Tech soon and transfering to Clemson, like she had planned, but she hasn't put anything into motion. She says she wants to go on a full scholarship so she can save her trust fund money for other things. (What's she going to do with it, put a downpayment on a house she can't finish paying for with a Wal-Mart job? Pay for her "boyfriend" to finally get divorced, then pay to marry him herself? Houses and husbands and boyfriends come and go, what's more important than an education that will serve her for the rest of her life? But I digress....)

I visited home over Christmas and got to see her. I met David and was not impressed. I got to see their rented house and was even less impressed. I got to meet the roommates, meet the cat, meet the dogs (we'll get more in depth on this part in a sec)..... Plaster Ashley's mom to the couch with a doobie and the TV on and it would have been like she had never moved out.

The dogs were sweet, but one in particular made me wince hard. His name was Sunny. He was a half-blood wolf dog. I don't know where she got him, but I could see in his eyes that he wasn't getting enough attention and would probably turn destructive. Ashley works a full-time job at Wal-Mart now, plays World of Warcraft fanatically whenever her brother isn't on the account, and is constantly running around with friends. Besides, she kept him in an (estimated) 24' by 24', fenced-in, concrete slab of a back yard. Even if she was walking him morning, noon, and night and playing with him every spare moment she had, he wouldn't be getting enough exercise. He's a very big dog. Besides, wolf breeds need large territories to roam. What she was doing to him I considered animal abuse. I didn't get enough time to talk to her about it while I was there, though (my brother, who I hadn't seen in almost 10 years, was visiting with his wife and kids for Christmas, too). The topic went down my list of priorities in my mind until I almost forgot about it completely.

Then a few months later, Ashley logged into Yahoo. She immediately jumped on me for sympathy, saying that Sunny had torn up stuff in the back yard and that she and David had given him away. I, suddenly remembering the way she was keeping him, (and suddenly re-surging with quite a bit of anger), responded that it was probably better for him and that the way she had been keeping him was turning him feral. Both Jess and I had seen it in him when we visited. That, though it hurt, she wasn't best for him and hopefully he would now have a happier life. She, in turn, was defensive. She sent several messages saying that Sonny didn't have a single bad tendency in him, that she had kept a "good paying job" (Wal-Mart, let me remind you) for quite a while, had moved out "on her own" (with a married man, may I remind you), and was doing well for herself. She then childishly turned off YIM without giving me a chance to respond, or appologize, or anything.

Now, I can understand this. Giving up a pet is hard. I've done it before, and looking back I should have been more understanding to her. I regretted what I said instantly. I had been so mad at how she was dragging a dog she didn't have the means to take care of into her life and not letting him go. (Honestly, it's what her mother did with all of her children.)

I decided at that time to give her some breathing space. We both needed to calm down about the issue. I figured in about a month I'd see her online again and I would send her an IM and say I'm sorry, and everything would been fine. That's how it usually is between me and my friends; we'd argue, we'd cool, we'd appologize, we'd be better friends than ever.

Today I loaded up my email and found that an old friend from South Carolina who I hadn't talked to in a long time had discovered my MySpace account and asked to be added as a friend. Though I almost never go on MySpace, I quickly logged on to say yes. (Honestly, adding people to my friends list is just about the only time I go on MySpace. Like I said, I'm a horrible corispondant....) Then I decided to poke around my friends list and see what everyone was doing. Ashley wasn't on my friends list. I figured it was a database error and flipped over to another friends's page and accessed her page from their friends list. I checked her current front page, noticed a few new blogs, then went to read them. What I found saddened me greatly.

QUOTE
Thursday, February 09, 2006

  GRRRRRRR
Current mood:  infuriated


OH oh oh. Furious right now!  So Sunny my puppy chewed something out in the yard, and the phone messed up, so Brandon suggested we give him to someone else. We gave him to David's friend, and he's happy so I'm happy but I miss him. WELL. I mentioned it to Christie, and got this Feyliya (last name deleted) (2/9/2006 12:51:16 AM): hon, both Jess and I could see it in his eyes when we met him (that he was going feral or some shit.) soon he would have been nipping people to get their attention, digging or jumping his way out of the fence, attacking strangers, barking, causing general destruction in the neighborhood....I know you love him but you weren't best for him ( Excuse me, you've never owned a big dog in your life how would you know, and he was fine never barked or growled in his life!)  Feyliya (last name deleted) (2/9/2006 12:52:42 AM): you just need to grow up enough to see it; sometimes what's best for someone isn't what you can give them.

Do what? SO! that made me mad So I replied. Ashley (name changed and last name deleted) (2/9/2006 9:59:12 AM): grow up? You know what? Just because I act silly sometimes does in no way mean I'm immature. I have kept a steady job at subway for nine months, found something better and have kept it three with no end in sight, i live on my own and own my own car that I bought with my own money. I think I'm damned doing well for myself.

She has done none of this. She's picked at me since high school implying that I'm just dumb little airheaded Ashley (name changed). Well news, I never was....wow, I feel betternow!


Right about that time I realized that she had probably deleted me off of her friends list of her own volition. That she was tossing out our almost 6-year friendship (wherein we had each considered each other best friends) for it. And not only that, but that she hadn't grown up in the slightest since high school.

By the way, I may have never owned a big dog but I know quite a bit about keeping them. My godfather had a giant Australian Sheep Dog that I helped take care of when I was younger. (Yes, I know that breed is supposed to be small....this dog was deffinitely a genetic anomaly.) I also spent most of my youthful time, from the time I was able to read on, studying animals in the hopes of some day becoming a Veterinarian. I know quite a bit about many, many different kinds of animals and their care, though I may never have owned one (nor seen one, in some cases) in my life. Also, I have never been anything less than supportive of Ashley the entire time I have known her. We've teased each other, yes, but I've never implied anything nasty about her nor "picked at" her.

To me, growing up has been about learning to admit your faults, and to live with them, and to work on them, and to not drag anyone along with you while you do it. To admit and learn from your mistakes. But since graduation, she hasn't done any of this. No, this isn't the only thing that's made me realize this, but this post is long enough without me going into any more detail of the things she's done to make me come to this conclusion. And it isn't just me that's come to this conclusion, Jess reached it even before I did (though she is still stepping carefully around Ashley to try and keep the relationship alive).

It saddens me that it's come to this. An end of an era, you could say. And honestly, I don't know if it's even worth appologizing, or attempting to make contact, or doing anything to try to salvage any part of the relationship. She's always been a flake (much though she'll deny it). She always forgets planned events with friends (many's the time when I've shown up at her house to pick her up for something we'd been planning for months only to find that she'd left with another friend to do something else an hour ago). She's never there for anyone when they need her. She is an even worse correspondant than I am (in fact, even though she lives in the same town as Jess she never calls or visits or makes any overtures to her). Jess and I have mutually come to the conclusion that she has a sort of tunnel vision and that she doesn't even remember people exist if they're not right there in front of her.

But still, she was a best friend for so long, and a friend when I had none. Even if we appologize and become friends again after this, she'll never rank as my best friend again (not without some serious self-realization on her part, anyway). The end of that hurts badly, more than I can convey in words.
vicrawr
*hug!* (O)_(O)
Laramon
I've been along for the ride for a long time now with her. This "Ashley" is a complete airhead who will never grow up. I have heard stories about her mother, and frankly it's all too obvious that she'll follow in her footsteps. And this David guy is obviously taking advantage of her airheadedness and her naivete. One day "Ashley" will wake up and find David either with another woman or back with his wife. Divorces can be filed for as little as $220. With 2 people working, even part time, that can be done in a month, not years. If he hasn't filed yet, it will never happen. But "Ashley" will never be the wiser to this.
Phyllis
QUOTE (Laramon @ Apr 3 2006, 07:17 PM)
Divorces can be filed for as little as $220.
*

Not necessarily. The amount it costs to file a divorce varies from state to state, and even within the counties of each state (mine cost somewhere just under $300 to file). If the divorce is contested, it costs considerably more than that...it would probably go into thousands of dollars. Additionally, if there is any real property to split up, he will probably need an attorney if there is any disagreement about how to split the stuff up.

There are also court fees to consider if there are any disputes that require a hearing, and fees that the sherrif charges for serving the spouse with the papers (unless you get a friend or relative to do it).

Not excusing what he's doing, mind you. Just telling you that divorce is more complicated and potentially expensive than you're making it sound. smile.gif

Anyway...blergh, that sucks, Fey. sad.gif There's not much you can do about the immaturity of others aside from hope they grow up soon. *hugs*
Feyliya
QUOTE (candice @ Apr 3 2006, 07:40 PM)
Anyway...blergh, that sucks, Fey.  sad.gif  There's not much you can do about the immaturity of others aside from hope they grow up soon.  *hugs*
*

Yeah, I've been hoping she'd hurry up and grow up soon, but I've steadily been realizing that it's not going to happen until she recieves a much bigger shock than what she's recieved so far. I thought the wake-up point would be when this married guy business ended messily (as everyone who knows her is certain it will), but it's been almost 2 years so far with no wake-up point in sight.

It worries me a lot that the only friends she has right now were David's friends first and that her brother is okay with David being married and sleeping with her (her brother is how she met David, actually). (Gods know that if a married friend of MY brother's so much as made a single overture at me, Chris would probably beat him to a pulp (or threaten to), not just in my name, but in his wife's.) I've just been so tired of stepping carefully around the subject and trying not to correct her when she calls him her "boyfriend" or celebrates an anniversary. It's not a boyfriend when he's married and you're sleeping with him, and it's not an anniversary if he can also claim an anniversary with his wife, for god's sake.

Then this happened.... It's like getting a slap in the face with her immaturity. Not only the immaturity factor that she only copied and pasted the bad things I had to say into her blog so that it'd look as bad as she could make it, but the immature way she put the blog up somewhere she knew I'd eventually see.

In fact, when I really look back, every time she has ever had a fight with anyone, it's ended with her ranting about it with her current friends and blocking that person out of her life. She's a really nice person and fun to be with when she's happy, so she never runs out.

That's also how her mom has spent her entire life. Find a guy to spend his money on you and house you and keep you happy(and occasionally the kids), then when it gets boring or something bad happens start looking for something else. That's how she's been through 7 marriages (that I know of).

Blah, I just want to wash my hands of the entire thing for a while. I'll probably see her next time I go to SC, maybe I'll try to patch up enough to be on speaking terms with her then. And, of course, when the David thing ends messily I'll still be there for her. Because it will, and because she's backed herself into a corner where she'll be left with no friends once it ends.

The worst part is that my sweet loving mother considers her to be her third child. I don't know whether she'll be childish enough to cut my mother out of her life, or selfish enough to let my mother keep spending money on her. (She spends a decent ammount of money on her. Taking her to meals, buying her clothes occasionally, buying her nice little things.... That's how my mom likes to show her love, by giving gifts.)

Blah...just blah I tell you.

*edit
You know, if we went by word count and not post count, I might have just made it into the top ten! tongue.gif I think I just dropped my spam tax by about 50%, too!
Phyllis
QUOTE (Feyliya @ Apr 3 2006, 08:14 PM)
I've just been so tired of stepping carefully around the subject and trying not to correct her when she calls him her "boyfriend" or celebrates an anniversary.  It's not a boyfriend when he's married and you're sleeping with him, and it's not an anniversary if he can also claim an anniversary with his wife, for god's sake.
*

Well, I don't know about that. Is he still living with his wife, or are they separated/estranged? If the relationship with his wife is over, whether or not he is still legally married doesn't affect the fact that he has a relationship with this other girl.

If he is still with his wife, then it is an affair. But if his relationship with his wife has ended, then I personally would say he is your friend's boyfriend, regardless of the legalities. If he doesn't celebrate any anniversaries with his wife anymore, he is free to date whoever and celebrate anniversaries with them instead.

But that's just the view of someone who has been through lengthy divorce proceedings and dated (and slept with) someone before the divorce had been filed. I'm legally divorced now, but my current relationship wasn't any less valid before that happened. My relationship with my ex was long over. If this guy is in the same boat...then I think you're being a bit harsh and judgmental in regards to the divorce thing. If he is still with his wife, though...then I agree with you.

Divorces are seldom easy or inexpensive. It's much easier to combine two lives...it often gets messy when trying to take them apart. Just keep that in mind before you judge him if he is indeed separated.
Rykan
*offers Feyliya a bag of cookies* thats such a terrible thing. I grew up very similarly to you (except I had two close friends rather than three). I can't imagine how terrible it must feel sad.gif
I suppose my advice would be to try and keep in contact, to show her you still care about her even if she seems to not care about you. She'll know you'll be there when it all gets very messy, and with any luck, she will grow up over time and learn to take better care of the friends she has and appreciate the ones who stuck by her even when she was being awful.
Feyliya
QUOTE (candice @ Apr 4 2006, 09:49 AM)
Well, I don't know about that.  Is he still living with his wife, or are they separated/estranged?  If the relationship with his wife is over, whether or not he is still legally married doesn't affect the fact that he has a relationship with this other girl.

If he is still with his wife, then it is an affair.  But if his relationship with his wife has ended, then I personally would say he is your friend's boyfriend, regardless of the legalities.  If he doesn't celebrate any anniversaries with his wife anymore, he is free to date whoever and celebrate anniversaries with them instead.

But that's just the view of someone who has been through lengthy divorce proceedings and dated (and slept with) someone before the divorce had been filed.  I'm legally divorced now, but my current relationship wasn't any less valid before that happened.  My relationship with my ex was long over.  If this guy is in the same boat...then I think you're being a bit harsh and judgmental in regards to the divorce thing.  If he is still with his wife, though...then I agree with you.

Divorces are seldom easy or inexpensive.  It's much easier to combine two lives...it often gets messy when trying to take them apart.  Just keep that in mind before you judge him if he is indeed separated.
*

You're quite right, I'm being a judgemental b!tch in this case. I do have good reasons to believe he's still seeing his "ex", though, even if Ashley refuses to see anything.

The big one is this:
The first time I ever heard about David, Ashley was complaining to me that he was in jail. I asked why. She said that his ex-wife (she refuses to call her anything else) had gotten a hold of his credit cards and bought a large ammount of illegal narcotics on it (I imagine by using an ATM or PayPal-ing the money, I don't know any drug dealers who take Visa). The cops traced the money, found the credit card, and arrested him. He supposedly had been separated from his wife for over a year at that time.

What I want to know is how the hell someone he hadn't seen in "over a year" (I'm quoting from memory, supposedly he hasn't laid eyes on her since he left her) got a hand on his credit card. She COULD have gotten a credit card in his name if she knew all the information and such, but from what Ashley said when I questioned her along those lines the credit card was apparently one he used frequently, and the reason she coudn't post bail was because the card had been over-charged by the drug deal and all their money (plus some) had gone to quickly pay off the excess before his credit rating was ruined.

There could be some lie involved somewhere that makes her getting her hands on the credit card not suspicious, but I think it's most likely that he went home, slept with his wife, and left his wallet behind by accident.

Of course, the last sentence could just be paranoid delusions of a nut who's thinking of the worst case scenario.

My biggest problem with the relationship, when I think about it, is that David didn't have enough respect for Ashley to wait to ask her out until the whole divorce from his crazy, drug-addled wife thing had ended. That and the fact that Ashley is so desperate for a man, any man, that she's willing to settle for a married guy who's in the middle of something like this. Yeah, love flourishes in adversity, but if they're so dedicated to each other that they want to get married (there's a promise ring involved now...) couldn't they have waited until the divorce was at least started?
Phyllis
If this woman is using his credit cards then it'll cost more than an incidental amount for him to divorce her. There will likely be legal battles over something like that.

Though the circumstances of her getting his money seem questionable. Also...credit cards for drugs? That is just bizarre. I'm wondering if he didn't do something illegal himself and lie to your friend about why he was in jail.

As for not waiting until the divorce was final to ask her out...I can't see the problem with that as long as he was separated at the time. Do you have any idea how long divorces take? 3 months in my state, if it's simple and uncontested. If it's contested...the person better prepare for a wait of at least a year or more.

I dunno. I'm not trying to side with him or anything, because he really doesn't seem like a very nice guy. I'm just saying that there are other, better reasons to dislike him (like the whole drugs thing) than the fact that he isn't legally divorced. Stuff happens. People fall in love at inconvenient times. And a year or more (or even 3 months if it was a simple divorce) is a long time to wait to test out a relationship.
Izzy
If David was arrested for drugs, wouldn't the police have known if he was telling the truth about his wife ( or ex-wife) taking his credit card and buying them. They could have just done a drug test, or searched his house for drugs. That is, unless they assume he re-sold them.

You've got some strong points, but so does Ashley. You can't blame her for missing her dog, and it isn't exactly animal abuse if she lets it out in the backyard, feeds it, and plays with it sometimes.

I agree with the thing Candice said about the divorce and calling it an "affair" or if they're "separated". I just don't see why his wife doesn't file for a divorce if he's living with another woman. If I was in his wife's position, I KNOW I would. Divorces usually do take a long time. One of my friend's (won't name people) parents are getting a divorce, and they'll still be living together for about another year.

Hopefully Ashley will grow up, be a little less ignorant and selfish, and you guys can be friends again. *hugs* Good Luck!

P.S. You should be like an author or something, you write really good!
Feyliya
QUOTE (devils_daughter @ Apr 4 2006, 02:02 PM)
You've got some strong points, but so does Ashley. You can't blame her for missing her dog, and it isn't exactly animal abuse if she lets it out in the backyard, feeds it, and plays with it sometimes.
*

Here's the big list of why having that dog was animal abuse (and, in fact, illegal). Remember, he's not just a dog, he's half wolf. BIG BIG BIG difference.

1) Wolf dogs are highly destructive. Without proper training, they will tear EVERYTHING apart, from woodwork and upholstry to your entire yard. They can and WILL do permanent damage to your house. Ashley is only renting a room in this house.

2) Training them takes much more time and effort than any regular dog, so you MUST have copious ammounts of time to spend with them. Housebreaking them alone takes months of almost constant work for it to be anything other than a hit-or-miss job. And they will NEVER be fully obedient.

3) They are not good with small animals or children as they have a strong prey drive (IE: Leave your wolf alone with something small that moves and you might come home to find bones). Ashley has a cat, her roommates have a small weiner dog, and her neighbors on both sides of her rented house have small children. Which leads me to...

4) Wolf dogs are the ULTIMATE escape artists. Six foot tall fences will do NOTHING when your wolf wants out. They can jump higher. Don't have your fence gate locked or chained? The dogs are smart enough to figure out how to open the gate. Think chaining them is the answer? WRONG! That's the quickest way to make your wolf dog go anti-social and mean, which will ultimately lead to the poor thing being put down.

5) Wolf dogs require expensive feed, not just grocery store kibble. They absolutely have to have a meat-based, high-protein, non-corn/soy, and low grains diet. You also have to feed them bones and raw meat. Anything less and the dog becomes malnourished. Ashley can't afford to feed him what he needs.

6) Ashley's neighborhood is about the most densely residential area in town. Wolf dogs howl, it carries for miles, and it can't be trained out of them.

7) Wolf dogs need almost constant companionship and a fairly large territory to roam. Keeping Sunny in a tiny back yard is cruel and adding another large dog (remember, anything smaller will possibly become prey) is flat out.

8) Wolf dogs are ILLEGAL to be kept in the area Ashley lives in. The only reason he managed to get liscenced is because the vet flat lied and said he was a pure-bred husky.

Add this all together and you get a very active, undernourished, half-wolf puppy living in a too small space, who has a high propensity to kill and eat small things, living in an area he can easily escape from, situated right beside where small children live (not to mention the cat and weiner dog in the house). And to top it all off, he's completely un-trained to boot (both Jess and I noticed this as well when we visited). And to make things even better, he's illegal in the first place, so if anything happened Ashley WOULD be tossed in jail, possibly with a manslaughter charge if things went really badly.

Gods....I really hope whoever she gave Sunny to can take care of him properly. He seemed like a really sweet dog when I met him and he deserves better than what he's had so far.

Okay, back to other topics that were brought up.

David was let out after a week when the cops realized he hadn't ever touched the drugs (or so Ashley told me). He told them that his credit card had been stolen. Ashley said he wanted to protect his "ex" so that she could continue to take care of her daughter (who is supposedly not his). I'm not even going to get into why a heroine-addicted mother shouldn't be raising a child, so let's move along here.

I know I'm being a priggish b!tch about the whole married/separated/dating someone else thing. Honestly, I usually don't have this many hang-ups about things like this. It's just that you guys haven't heard her. Whenever you point out that she's heavily Christian and that no adultery is one of the core tenants of the religion, she just changes the subject. It's one of the foundations of a religion that she says she believes and follows with all her heart, yet the first test of her conviction and she blows it and refuses to even acknowledge anything about it. All she ever says is that she loves him and that he doesn't love his wife and does love her....well how do you think he got married to his wife in the first place? One day he stood up in a church, in front of a minister, their combined family and friends, and God him/herself and swore that he loved the woman before him with all his heart and that only death would part them. And Ashley refuses to even contemplate that.

I guess you could say that the thing I hate the worst about this relationship is the blasphemy and hypocracy involved. Funny that a Solitary Eclectic Pagan should be obsessing so much over a Christian's broken moral code, huh? laugh.gif

I know you're not siding with him, Candice, and I appreciate the things you are saying. It helps me get a better, more centered focus on things. I really am too close to this. If I were a judge or juror, I'd have to recuse myself.

And yes, devils_daughter, I do write. I just have to finish my book and find an agent and get it edited and published.... I fully expect to have a New York Times Bestseller out by October this year. Really. ph34r.gif

*edit
Oh yeah, my spam tax should be almost nil by now. RAWR!
{Gothic Angel}
*Cuddle* Some people don't deserve the friends, support, and lives they have. And some people can't see clear that they're destroying their futures. Having spent the last year and a half running around after a similar person trying to get her life back on track -seriously, just forget about her. If all she can do is hurt you when all you do is help her, screw her. Particularly if you have two nice people who agree with you and are on your side.

Alternatively - send her anthrax through the post wink.gif
monkey_called_narth
im tottaly with Feyliya on her animal abuse charges. im going equate a wolf dog to the coydogs in my area which happen when people that live in the country leave there female dogs in heat outside over night.

the affect is the same as a wolf dog she described, but there are many more reasons for danger of having a half breed dog, and in my area you are ordered by law to put any coydogs down. a few events that have happened in c-ville:

1. a coydog broke into the house of a family with two small children wanting food, it got in threw the 4 year olds open window. the child only suffered a few bites befor the parents woke up, but it could have been devistating.

2. my freind Karen had a coydog walk right threw her front door and attack both her cats, killing one of them.

3. a coydog had came all the way into the middle of ca-ville and was at the square. it chased 3 childern whom were walking home from school into a store and proceded to make mayhem at the city square. the coydog had to eventually be shot becasue no one could get it under control enough to take it out of town, or to the shelter, and it kept attacking anyone that got near it.

half-breed dogs (i.e. coydogs) dont have the natural inhaibitions and habits that our domesticated dogs have from selective breeding. most coydogs are brought into homes at young ages so whenever they want food they WILL go in your home. having a dog thats half anything other then full dog, is a bad idea and very dagerouse. even with proper care they can still lash out at people with devistating affects. you cant tottaly train an animal from the wild, and im amaised she even thought it was a good idea to keep one near small children. i dont like the idea of putting dogs down, but coydogs and wolf dogs are BAD, and i understand why there are laws to put them down in my area. the examepls i listed all happned in the last 5-6 mounths since my move back to carlinville.
Izzy
QUOTE
And yes, devils_daughter, I do write.  I just have to finish my book and find an agent and get it edited and published....  I fully expect to have a New York Times Bestseller out by October this year.  Really. ph34r.gif



Oh, really? What's the tittle going to be, if it's good I'll buy/read it.
Feyliya
Talked to my mom today. Ashley is still hanging around my mom and letting her take her out places and buy her stuff. From what I can tell she's blown up, smeared my name with every person in our peer group in SC, then completely forgot that there might be concequences (like, I don't know, me finding out about it and not being particularly happy). I guess time will tell me for sure. But one way or another, she's lost all her friend privledges. If I ever speak to her or see her again, it will probably be too soon.

I've pretty much decided how our relationship is going to go from now on. She can seek me out and talk to me all she wants. I'll be here, but I'm not going to be doing any more work on keeping touch with her. The friendship is up to her now.

And yes, no keeping touch with her means no envelopes full of anthrax mailed to her house. Tempting though it may be.... laugh.gif

QUOTE (devils_daughter @ Apr 7 2006, 11:02 AM)
Oh, really? What's the tittle going to be, if it's good I'll buy/read it.
*

I was being sarcastic earlier. I'm nowhere near finished with a book. Still don't even have a title, either. Frankly, I blame Matazone. :: points at post count and join date:: rolleyes.gif
Izzy
QUOTE (Feyliya @ Apr 8 2006, 04:30 PM)

QUOTE (devils_daughter @ Apr 7 2006, 11:02 AM)
Oh, really? What's the tittle going to be, if it's good I'll buy/read it.
*

I was being sarcastic earlier. I'm nowhere near finished with a book. Still don't even have a title, either. Frankly, I blame Matazone. :: points at post count and join date:: rolleyes.gif

*



tongue.gif oh. Hard to tell when someone's being sarcastic over the internet. laugh.gif
Daria
QUOTE (Feyliya @ Apr 8 2006, 10:30 PM)

I've pretty much decided how our relationship is going to go from now on.  She can seek me out and talk to me all she wants.  I'll be here, but I'm not going to be doing any more work on keeping touch with her.  The friendship is up to her now.

*

I had a friend who decided we shouldn't be friends. I was a little upset, but then realised that she wasn't worth crying over as if she was such a good friend, she would be the one who makes the effort etc etc. She also has her "clique", and decides who should and shoudln't be in it. It is quite an exclusive club, and once you are out, almost everyone in it ignores you as well. Very VERY childish if you remember that they are 17/18.
So I just left it- I couldn't care less how she was acting if she was going to be that immature- and guess what- she appologised recently (well we both did, but her first), at a party we met at, and had a drink and it was left on the terms of"I don't hate you, but I don't see the point in trying to make this friendship work". Lo and behold, a couple of days ago she contacted me and she is coming over for some food and some film watching on thursday. This has taken me aback somewhat as apart from her actually making an effort, she is also traveling about 45 miles (round trip) to come see me. I am rather cynicaly wondering what her alterior motive is, but there might not be one!

All I am trying to say is that your friend will hopefully one day grow up and realise just HOW good to her you were, and that she was a fool to be so silly.
Feyliya
What I figure will happen is that after a few months of me ignoring her existance she'll suddenly start to wonder why I'm not talking to her. Especially if she notices me being on YIM or something of the sort and something bad has happened to her (every time something doesn't go her way she contacts everyone she knows to complain about it). I figure she's so used to people making allowances for her horrible social skills that she just can't understand why people don't jump to talk to her as soon as they see her.

I imagine she has a big, horribly over-dramatic speech planned about how I've wronged her and how I'm just a big meanie who doesn't deserve her notice for when I contact her next (I know that's what I would have done when I was 14 or so). She's going to be quite perturbed when she realizes that the ball is firmly in her court and that I really don't give a rat's whether we ever speak again.
{Gothic Angel}
QUOTE
And yes, no keeping touch with her means no envelopes full of anthrax mailed to her house. Tempting though it may be....


Awww. I'll do it if you want? tongue.gif Anything for a matazone oldie (and to distract me from endless A-level revision laugh.gif)

It never ceases to amaze me how so many people can so thoroughly feck up relationships without realising it. Surely it should be obvious to the most simple mind that if you insult, whinge, bitch about and generally flame someone, hey, you might not be their favourite person anymore?
Feyliya
Yeah, Ashley is very bad at seeing the far-reaching results of her actions. But oh well, nothing I can do will change that. At least I see it better now.

In other news, Ashley has been talking to other people at work about leaving David. Not directly to my mom yet, but my mom's heard her talking about it to others. From what Mom can tell, Ashley doesn't know where to go if she does leave him, and that's what's keeping her with him right now. So my mom's going to mention to her that she's thinking of renting out my old room for a rediculously low price, and ask her what she thinks of the idea. The hope, of course, being that she'll get the idea and rent it herself.

The only bad part about having Ashley in my old room is that my mom has high blood pressure and it would be bad for her if David comes harassing her. So I'm going to alert Jess to the new situation. I doubt David could find where Jess lives (she's waaaaay out in the arse-end of nowhere) so Ashley could hide out there for a week or so until things die down a bit. Then she can move into my mom's place.

Once she's in my mom's going to tell Ashley that if she goes back to college she'll lower the rent a ton (maybe even drop it entirely).

After it's all settled, I'll think about giving her a piece of my mind, and maybe a second chance. It'll all depend on her actions from here on out. For now, the ball's still firmly in her court.
Feyliya
Well, Ashley IMed my friend Laz the other day. She told him, and I quote, "I think Christie and Randy might be mad at me." Hmm....ya think? I wonder why.... rolleyes.gif Anyway, I'm too busy to track her down and tell her exactly why I'm mad at her, so she's still going to have to contact me. And when she does (if she does), I think I'm going to be quoting from this thread a lot. I think my initial post is probably the most rational I've been about all this.
{Gothic Angel}
On the plus side, she's obviously not deliberately and maliciously tried to upset you so you can give her a good ol' guilt trip when you do see her again tongue.gif
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