"homophobia", you buggers can't start a new thread Options

[CommieBastard]

What is needed, though (and I've said this many times before) is that the community needs a gay version of Martin Luther King. Someone who can speak eloquently and evenly about the plight. One who can raise a call to arms and have people actually listen.

Something tells me it's not going to be Graham Norton

[Tigersong]

I think it has come along way.. don’t get me wrong. From the time I was in high school till today.. I can see a 100% change. But I don’t think we have done enough.. and I think we need to be proactive instead of reactionary. But I am speaking of gay rights in my area.. different areas have different programs. Almost all other gay rights movements pale in comparison to San Frans gay rights movement. So I guess it depends on where you are in the world. Where I am from I don’t think we have done nearly enough.. Virginia (our sister state) just passed a law outlawing all gay marriage and civil unions. We should be up their ass right now... but instead they have called for a boycott of Virginia. Now that solves nothing.. we are giving them what they want by staying away.. I say.. we all go to Virginia and show them how wonderful we really are. My point is while I feel we have made some progress.. it is not nearly enough.

Point taken. You're right -- it really does depend on the place you're living in what the state of gay rights are. On the other hand, I think that's fairly true for most "isms"

[Cthulhu]

My partner and I considered making a trip up to Mass. to get married, but we decided against it. We originally were thinking of going to Hawaii because at that time we owned a time share there. Again, we didn't. Why? Well, for the most part, being married in a state that doesn't recognize it would only cause problems and offer no real benifits. So definatly there are big differences depending on where you live. In some states it's still actually illegal and heck, it's even illegal in some states to get a tattoo, talk about screwed up!

I don't know, do we need a MLK Jr.? Not really. His biggest impact was as a martyr. A gay martyr, I think, would actually have the opposite effect of what we'd like. Most people who are gay bashers would just think it was a good thing and applaud it and move on with their lives. It probably wouldn't have the same impact as MLK Jr. had. Besides, have you ever tried to organize a group of gay men to do something other than get together for sex? YEESH! Like the person said (I forget who said it, a few posts back) Ravin, yeah, sorry about that, like Ravin said, most gay men are too gay. I'm talking about what I call the Swish to Reality factor. My biggest problem with being gay is being associated with those gay men who love to put on affectations and act like swishy little twits. Most of them do it consciously, it isn't something that comes along with being gay. It's almost like they're saying "I want to be so different that I piss people off", that doesn't help anyone.

Oh well. I have to go apply more product now.

[PsychWardMike]

Yeah... the oeverly gay people don't exactly do much for the cause. Trust me... I like gay guys (a lot ) even I get sick of the fabulous queens. I can name one guy in particular at my school that has done more to enforce gay stereotypes, (and subsequently more hate) by being overly gay as he walks around. I know him... he's not normally like that, but I'll be damned if he doesn't do it in public.

*sigh* It's too bad, really. Balance is the key, here people.

[Mata]

I think that in some ways Freddie Mercury did a lot of good for gay awareness. Many people hadn't even thought about his sexuality at all until the time of his death. The music of Queen was rock and embraced by many of the most butch men in our societies but then you couldn't help but know that not only was Mercury gay, but also that he was most likely HIV positive during a lot of his later recording career.

I think the revalation that a guy could be gay and HIV positive without this being an issue for him personally that he made obvious for everyone else was something that really made a difference to a lot of people. It was a subtle change, but I think that something did happen there.

I've thought about all this a lot. I do sometimes wonder if we're going about this the wrong way. Obviously movements such as Stonewall were essential to get the legal barriers out of the way, but maybe now those of us with non-heterosexual sensibilities need to integrate ourselves rather than continue with the poltics of difference. We need to concentrate on what we all have in common.

A lot of straight people I know ask what the point is of the TGB Pride march, and why shouldn't there be a Straight Pride march, in some ways they have a point. I think that sometimes such obvious segregation of a community has a negative result.

Until there truly are equal rights then such things do serve the purpose of reminding people in power that there are still issues that need to be addressed, but as has been pointed out in this thread already, Pride is often seen as a pick-up point, not political activism. Perhaps the way forward for culture just comes from being ourselves and trying to not be afraid of who knows about this. My parents don't know anyone (as far as they know) who isn't straight, and they had a rough time dealing with me being bi. I'm sure they must have known gay people at some point in their lives, and if they had realised this then maybe things would have been easier.

Of course, it's all well and good me saying this when people are still beaten to death for not being straight, but I also believe in a ripple effect. Sure, it might start with increased tolerence in New York, Sydney, London, San Francisco, Brighton, Milan... But these places have influence, and eventually the culture changes. Maybe one day of marching is moving away from being so important, and maybe that's a good sign.

I've reached the end of tying that and now I'm really not sure what point I was trying to make!

[MoonlightSavings...]

Ya know what really burns my britches, all the gamers out there who just throw the word "gay" around as a derogative statement as if it's now synonamous with "bad" or "dork" or "jerK" or any other negative thing. It shows me how unbelievably ignorant they are. It happens at least 10 to 20 times a day when I'm in a game, doesn't matter what game, UT2k4, UT2k3, City of Heroes, FarCray, Halo, you name it. Someone's gonna say "that was gay" or "this map is gay" or "that idea is gay". What do you say to a jerk like this? If you say anything it's immediatly going to mean to them that you're gay and that's just opening up a can of worms you don't wanna open. But to just sit there and ignore that kind of ignorance and hatred isn't good either.

I hear you loud and clear. My boyfriend is a gamer, so we're constantly seeing idiot gamers out there tossing around the words "gay" and "fag" as if there are no other [negative] words in the language. I cannot begin to tell you how much that bugs the effin' crap out of me.

As for the "gay movement," I think the problem is that most "gay activists" seem to be turning inward more than outward, so everyone is concentrating too much effort on self-proclamation and self-acceptance (which, don't get me wrong, is completely important, but not at the complete expense of other issues) and not focusing enough on inclusion or educating the public on homosexuality/bisexuality. It seems that so many people go to pride parades and gay bars and gay restaurants and gay cruises and gay mortgage companies and nothing else, so in the end the whole "movement" and everything about homosexuality seem to be an exclusive, segregationist club where heterosexuals aren't allowed and that heterosexuals are too daft to understand. "You're never going to understand us, so we're not even going to bother including you in our communities, and we don't want to be a part of yours" -- seems to be the message that the majority are sending.

The "gay movement" seems to be way too centralized around increasing LGBTI visibility through pride parades, which only alienates everyone who can't identify as a feather-boa-wearing gay man or cross-dresser. The only people becoming more visible in pride parades are those who are way too far on the fringe for average suburban middle-class nuclear families to identify with or accept. It just seems like everyone's further alienating themselves from the "mainstream," rather than advancing the movement any further.

It's really odd -- I never really contemplated the idea of having an MLK Jr fronting our movement. It's sad to think that we don't really have our own spokesperson. And when we do get spokespersons, they only last as long as their coming-out debacle lasts, and then they lose interest in pursuing any further rights for the movement as a whole. I'm mostly talking about newly-out celebrities who suddenly make it their mission to further gay civil rights, only to lose interest in the whole issue once they've overcome the coming-out hurdle and have regained some sort of acceptance and credibility in their respective communities. I can't help thinking specifically of Rosie O'Donnell, who tried to divert attention away from her own newly-outed self by focusing attention on the Florida couple who weren't being allowed to adopt children. As soon as she completed that spectacle, she seemed to have dropped off the scene. A lot of people seem to do that very same thing.

[MistressAlti]

What many GLBTs don't seem to understand is, the best way to gain understanding and tolerance from "the straight world" is to live IN the straight world. Ambassadors, if you will. Nearly all of the accepting straight individuals I've ever met said that their pro-tolerance mindsets were swayed by the positive influences of GLBTs in their lives. They don't give a damn about parades, they don't give a damn about the HRC and their missions, they don't even really give a damn about what religion or politics seems to think of GLBT issues. But they DO give a damn about the GLBTs in their lives.

Unfortunately, most of the efforts that we are currently making are simply preaching to the converted.

Perhaps, if we focused our efforts on being positive ambassadors to the straight communities of the world, they'd be more sympathetic to our cause. Just a thought.

[ravein]

"the straight world" is to live IN the straight world

In my opinion there is no other choice. Unless you move to a gay island.. and as far as I know there is no gay island...and if there was I am not sure I would want to live there... cause god knows we can be some trifling ass people!

I agree with what you say though. I have never hid my homosexuality (except in my home town cause my father would kill me.. really he would.. I am not joking at all).. I have always been out at every job I have ever had. By putting a face on homosexuality you humanize it. People are afraid of what they do not understand, if you help them understand homosexuality and the fact that it does not change the value of the person you eventually defeat homophobia. But I still believe there is a basic need for the HRC, pride marches, white parties, feather boas, hot oil, and free drinks before 10.. oh wait.. what was I talking about... oh yeah.. there is a need for these things. They are not an end all solution but they do serve a purpose in the gay community.

[Fluffy]

I think that a lot of the fuel behind the hate against gay people is that they're associated with completely seperate things that really are wrong (i.e. pedophilia), and then everyone thinks that all gay people are child molesters. I mean, I was molested by my bisexual cousin, I'm heterosexual, we're both guys, but I realize that not all bisexuals are like that (if I did, I wouldn't be on these forums, eh?), I merely have, hopefully permanently, severed all ties to my cousin, and explained why he won't be at my parties anymore to my closest friends. But I digress. Why must we hate someone merely because they are not like us? Gay people, in general, have done nothing to us as far as I can see. The point is we're all human beings, and therefore, should be treated equally. Even several people in one of my classes who could, personality-wise, be described as the standard teenager, stated, "They're not doing anything to us. Why don't we just mind our own business?" If only everyone was as wise as they. To quote Vash the Stampede, "This world is made of Love and Peace!"

P.S. Also, against the religious anti-gay argument, at least the one some of my fellow Christians use, whether or not God forbade homosexuality, I cannot be sure, however, I do know that God said the two most important rules were basically love God and love each other. Therefore, making hate against homosexuals sinful in the Christian religion whether or not homosexuality is disallowed (and I don't think it is).

[#tay]

P.S. Also, against the religious anti-gay argument, at least the one some of my fellow Christians use, whether or not God forbade homosexuality, I cannot be sure, however, I do know that God said the two most important rules were basically love God and love each other. Therefore, making hate against homosexuals sinful in the Christian religion whether or not homosexuality is disallowed (and I don't think it is).

Well, I'm not too sure whether or not the Bible actually forbids "being" homosexual, but I'm pretty sure I heard something about it forbidding homosexual acts. Something like "Thou shall not lie with a woman as you would a man, it is abomination." I dunno. Religion really isn't my thing. I 'do' know that you're absolutely right about the "love God and love each other" part.

All sins, from what I've heard, were created equal, and by hating and discriminating against someone because they're homosexual, you're also committing a sin, and pretty much aren't any "better" than they are after that. And they probably never sinned in the first place, so you've wasted your time bothering them.